1977 911S-Restore or sell?
08-13-2003, 12:05 AM
#16
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Tim,
If it was running fine when it was parked you may get lucky and just be able to due like Suresh.
I'll probably get flamed for this but, I would see if I could get the 2.7 up and going. If the head studs haven't pulled yet, you may be one of the lucky few that the car goes to 150K. While a pile (most?) of 2.7's (including my first one) pull studs, there are those out there that don't, or at least hang in there well over 100K. If so it would be by far the most cost effective solution. And if they do go in the next 20K then start thinking about the 3l or3.2l.
A compression/leakdown will tell you allot, just don't be scared by the numbers until everything is loosened up and you work the goo out of it.
Get a popoff valve installed before you try and get it started! I can guarantee this thing is going to backfire before you get it going. Also, with cars that sit a long time I would check the chain tensioners very carefully, get rid of the 77 exhaust for a 74, and dump the air pump. Suresh gave you a good starting list of things that will need to get done, It will all depend on how it was stored.
Getting old 911's going again can be a lot of fun, there is a bit of Indiana Jones archeology involved...(just make sure it's not the temple of doom)...
If it was running fine when it was parked you may get lucky and just be able to due like Suresh.
I'll probably get flamed for this but, I would see if I could get the 2.7 up and going. If the head studs haven't pulled yet, you may be one of the lucky few that the car goes to 150K. While a pile (most?) of 2.7's (including my first one) pull studs, there are those out there that don't, or at least hang in there well over 100K. If so it would be by far the most cost effective solution. And if they do go in the next 20K then start thinking about the 3l or3.2l.
A compression/leakdown will tell you allot, just don't be scared by the numbers until everything is loosened up and you work the goo out of it.
Get a popoff valve installed before you try and get it started! I can guarantee this thing is going to backfire before you get it going. Also, with cars that sit a long time I would check the chain tensioners very carefully, get rid of the 77 exhaust for a 74, and dump the air pump. Suresh gave you a good starting list of things that will need to get done, It will all depend on how it was stored.
Getting old 911's going again can be a lot of fun, there is a bit of Indiana Jones archeology involved...(just make sure it's not the temple of doom)...
08-13-2003, 01:06 AM
#17
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Tim:
Sounds like you are getting yourself into a very exciting project! I am jealous!!! Remember, even 10 years back, most 2.7 engines were likely gone through, so make sure you don't rip that engine out without giving it a fair chance!
If you need another engine try these two places, both in the SF bay area:
http://www.partsheaven.com
http://www.easypor.com
Do some reading too if you have time: I love Wayne Dempsey's book and am happy with the bentley manual. Both can be found online / in your bookstore. Good Luck!
Cheers, George
Sounds like you are getting yourself into a very exciting project! I am jealous!!! Remember, even 10 years back, most 2.7 engines were likely gone through, so make sure you don't rip that engine out without giving it a fair chance!
If you need another engine try these two places, both in the SF bay area:
http://www.partsheaven.com
http://www.easypor.com
Do some reading too if you have time: I love Wayne Dempsey's book and am happy with the bentley manual. Both can be found online / in your bookstore. Good Luck!
Cheers, George
08-13-2003, 03:03 AM
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"Sounds like you are getting yourself into a very exciting project! I am jealous!!! Remember, even 10 years back, most 2.7 engines were likely gone through, so make sure you don't rip that engine out without giving it a fair chance!"
Yes... this is absolutely true. The bad rap the 2.7's got was for pulling studs within the first few years of the engine's life (ie: under 50,000 miles). The very latest of these 2.7 cars are now 26 years old, and the chances are very high that the necessary work was already done years ago.
Why would a 26-30 year old engine suddenly start pulling head studs at this late date?
-MAS
Yes... this is absolutely true. The bad rap the 2.7's got was for pulling studs within the first few years of the engine's life (ie: under 50,000 miles). The very latest of these 2.7 cars are now 26 years old, and the chances are very high that the necessary work was already done years ago.
Why would a 26-30 year old engine suddenly start pulling head studs at this late date?
-MAS
08-13-2003, 08:58 AM
#19
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Thanks for the sites George. I will check them out.
I will take a look at the 2.7 in hopes that it has all the recommended upgrades and will be fine. MAS I would suspect, given the mileage on the car now, that some of the upgrades have been done. However, if I have to spend too much to revive the 2.7 I would like to consider a swap if the price differential is not too great. Also I have successfully primed the wife regarding the possible expenditures of an engine swap. Should the need for the swap come 20k miles down the road, the winds may be blowing the other way. Of course having found this great site and you kind people, I will always be preparing her for the next project.
Thanks, Tim
I will take a look at the 2.7 in hopes that it has all the recommended upgrades and will be fine. MAS I would suspect, given the mileage on the car now, that some of the upgrades have been done. However, if I have to spend too much to revive the 2.7 I would like to consider a swap if the price differential is not too great. Also I have successfully primed the wife regarding the possible expenditures of an engine swap. Should the need for the swap come 20k miles down the road, the winds may be blowing the other way. Of course having found this great site and you kind people, I will always be preparing her for the next project.
Thanks, Tim
08-13-2003, 09:03 PM
#20
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Tim, I also have a 77' 911s with a questionable 2.7s motor in it. I was also thinking of the 3.0 or 3.2 engine swap. Where do you live? I just picked my 77' up last weekend. Maybe we can do this together. Wife is also in "go" status.
08-14-2003, 08:39 AM
#21
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Trust,
I wish I could take you up on the offer, but the commute would be a little much from Charlotte NC. Good luck with your project and keep me in the loop on how its going. I'm going to pick up the 911S within the next couple of weeks. I'm still considering keeping the 2.7. Cost may be a factor in putting in a 3.0 or 3.2. The prices I have seen on the web for a 3.2 range from $4500 (150K miles) to $6000 (50K). I have found only one 3.0 on ebay, cost unknown. Do you know of any reputable sources for 3.0 or 3.2s? Locally, they are non-existent. I don't mind paying shipping for the engine. I just want a reliable, reputable source so I don's end up with a Temple of Doom as J Richard mentioned.
I wish I could take you up on the offer, but the commute would be a little much from Charlotte NC. Good luck with your project and keep me in the loop on how its going. I'm going to pick up the 911S within the next couple of weeks. I'm still considering keeping the 2.7. Cost may be a factor in putting in a 3.0 or 3.2. The prices I have seen on the web for a 3.2 range from $4500 (150K miles) to $6000 (50K). I have found only one 3.0 on ebay, cost unknown. Do you know of any reputable sources for 3.0 or 3.2s? Locally, they are non-existent. I don't mind paying shipping for the engine. I just want a reliable, reputable source so I don's end up with a Temple of Doom as J Richard mentioned.
09-04-2003, 06:31 PM
#22
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Hello All,
I have gotten the car down here to NC. It looks like mice or some type of other rodents have gotten into the trunk, interior and possibly the engine. I haven't yet assessed the extent of their intrusion into the engine. Also the interior is quite musty and has developed mold on some of the surfaces, although the leather sport seats seem to be in good condition. There was thick layer of dust on the car that I hope has not damaged the paint.
The good news is that many of the upgrades you have been talking about appear to have been done by the prior owner(s) including the 11 blade fan, second oil cooler, and removal of the thermal reactors. Also no rust.
It comes with the cookie cutters with dry rotted 205/60/15s. Has any one encountered rodent problems and can give some insight on potential problems they cause particularly with engine components and vital systems?
Thanks, Tim
I have gotten the car down here to NC. It looks like mice or some type of other rodents have gotten into the trunk, interior and possibly the engine. I haven't yet assessed the extent of their intrusion into the engine. Also the interior is quite musty and has developed mold on some of the surfaces, although the leather sport seats seem to be in good condition. There was thick layer of dust on the car that I hope has not damaged the paint.
The good news is that many of the upgrades you have been talking about appear to have been done by the prior owner(s) including the 11 blade fan, second oil cooler, and removal of the thermal reactors. Also no rust.
It comes with the cookie cutters with dry rotted 205/60/15s. Has any one encountered rodent problems and can give some insight on potential problems they cause particularly with engine components and vital systems?
Thanks, Tim
09-05-2003, 02:30 AM
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Usually rodents like to go for the rubber stuff in the engine compartment. Especially newer components that still have that yummy fresh rubber taste. We had some serious problems with martens in Europe going especially through freshly installed components. I would check plug wires and all rubber vacuum and fuel lines. There is of course no hardcore damage that can be done to the aluminum and steel components but elecytrical wiring is another thing to worry about. Find find all vacuum leaks the buggers might have created b/c the CIS doesn't like vacuum leaks.
Good Luck, George
Good Luck, George
12-05-2003, 07:51 AM
#25
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Hi everyone,
I wanted to thank you for all of your input. I am pleased to say that the 2.7 is running great. I had a local mechanic take a good look before I invested the time and $$ bringing 77 back to life. It had approx. 93K miles and a majority of the necessary upgrades and problems addressed. The reactors had been removed and 11 blade fan installed by PO. Trombone cooler is in place. The engine studs also check out fine. After having cleaned out the rodent nests etc, the engine fired right up. Needed a new gas tank (rust) and lines though and installed a pop-off as well as the carrera tensioners. With a little interior work to repair the little rodents' work, I will have a nice little driver.
Thanks again, Tim
I wanted to thank you for all of your input. I am pleased to say that the 2.7 is running great. I had a local mechanic take a good look before I invested the time and $$ bringing 77 back to life. It had approx. 93K miles and a majority of the necessary upgrades and problems addressed. The reactors had been removed and 11 blade fan installed by PO. Trombone cooler is in place. The engine studs also check out fine. After having cleaned out the rodent nests etc, the engine fired right up. Needed a new gas tank (rust) and lines though and installed a pop-off as well as the carrera tensioners. With a little interior work to repair the little rodents' work, I will have a nice little driver.
Thanks again, Tim
12-05-2003, 01:09 PM
#26
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Suresh,
I bought my 944 after it had sat unused for about 6-1/2 years. This was about 2 years ago. I did all the things you did. All new hoses, belts, filters, fluids, brakes, tires, etc. All service was brought up to date. Obviously, the 944 and the old 911 couldn't be more different cars...but your perception that the car seemed to get better and better is accurate. My 944, even with ALL that work seemed "unsorted", sorta "odd" feeling. Of course I got used to the car, but I am certain it really did run better as the miles piled up. Now it runs strong for the sporty little car that it is as opposed to the true "sports car" that the 911 is.
I bought my 944 after it had sat unused for about 6-1/2 years. This was about 2 years ago. I did all the things you did. All new hoses, belts, filters, fluids, brakes, tires, etc. All service was brought up to date. Obviously, the 944 and the old 911 couldn't be more different cars...but your perception that the car seemed to get better and better is accurate. My 944, even with ALL that work seemed "unsorted", sorta "odd" feeling. Of course I got used to the car, but I am certain it really did run better as the miles piled up. Now it runs strong for the sporty little car that it is as opposed to the true "sports car" that the 911 is.
01-18-2004, 03:27 PM
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Tim I would agree with Bryan and recommend that you take your car to EuroWerks in Charlotte. Jim Burton owns the shop and is one of the best mechanics that I have ever dealt with. I have been taking my 964 to him and he does great work.