tomc_85.5_944

Heres the story....
Got the flywheel lock, found TDC, so I think, using the straw and cam mark method (still unclear on the flywheel mark under the car method) and did the belts. Nothing has changed as far as I could tell, and I got everything tensioned correctly, as far as I could tell. Went to turn the motor over by hand, starter not even installed, and NOTHING. Can't turn the motor over clockwise or counter. Pulled the plugs to release compression, and still no go. Going to recheck everything after lunch, but has this happened to anyone before? I figured that if I was off timing wise, I'd at least be able to turn the motor one way a bit before hitting something.

jonnybgood

Perhaps a stupid question but did you remove the flywheel lock?

SoCal Driver

Didn't we have this conversation before?

I seriously questioned IF you had the car at TDC as you didn't find the TDC mark and made sure it was in alignment befor you put the belt on.

Now I can tell you how to correct it BUT you have to find the TDC mark first.

emilysgranny

Johnny ; thats funny , should be a classic. But the truth is , it is always something stupid we overlook and when you find it you have to laugh at yourself. Kind of like the time I did a tuneup ,slamed the hood ,went in and turned the key only to here thud ,thud from under the hood. Turns out I just layed the plugs in the plug hole and never screwed them in when I put the new wires on. Kid busted me for yrs over that one.

tomc_85.5_944

Flywheel lock is off. First thing I checked..

I arrived at TDC with the cam gear mark and the straw in the hole method. Assuming, even if I was not at TDC exactly, and put the flywheel lock on, and it went on correctly, and I pulled the timing belt after the lock was on, and the cam mark lined up the same before and after, then the motor should not have moved. Back to pull the belts and attempt to get everything lined up again, after researching the "bottom hole method"

This still begs the question, shouldn't I be able to turn it one way or the other, until I hit something?

SoCal Driver

When the cam timing is off you can not turn it with out hitting a valve.

Your TDC method is wrong.

Bones944

you find the TDC mark on the flywheel from above the car

tomc_85.5_944

Bones, after using the straw in #1 to get close, I have no marks on my flywheel, looking through the little window.....

Cam gear mark lined (and lines) up perfectly.

Got down under the car, looking through the round inspection port on the flywheel cover, and no marks either, just lots of rust.
What am I missing?????? Can I be that far off, even with checking the top of the piston? I guess so.

Am I going to have to pull the tower as I read somewhere and start from scratch? Can I remove the belts and attempt to move things slightly, and go from there?

SoCal Driver

Stop being a twit and take the BOTTOM cover off of the bell housing and start cleaning the flat edge on the fly wheel. There IS a TDC mark on the flywheel.

The BOTTOM COVER is the one that is held on by two ridiculously large bolts.

tomc_85.5_944

And that is where the confusion lay... I was looking through the clutch inspection cover, and had not taken the bottom cover off. I am indeed off TDC. Bottom cover, not clutch inspection hole, for anyone else that was confused. Clear as a bell now. Going to attempt to loosen the belt, and move the crank to TDC now, leaving the cam gear where it is. Any other tips or tricks to doing this, other than being careful, and painitng the mark on the flywheel white, although now that i know about the bottom cover, this shouldn't be an issue.

Magnus

It is very hard to turn the engine if yor are in gear and and the e-brake is on, have you check that?

//Magnus

tomc_85.5_944

I think it was very hard for me to turn the motor as I was using the standard length Craftsman 1/2 socket wrench. Put a 2' cheater on it, and the motor turned, Was not hitting any valves, but figured out where they were by rotating the cam and them moving the crank. Think my timing might have been off by a tooth. Got it straightend out, and am in the process of getting everything back together. Not real comfortable on my Kricket belt measurements so I may take it by a shop anyway, just to check the tension out. We'll see.

SoCal, although I am very appreciative of the help, to resort to name calling when a new owner is attempting his first repair is kinda childish, dontcha think. I mean, we are all adults here, or at least I am, and I would appreciate being treated as such. I have not asked any overtly stupid questions, and have done the best I could with the information I have. You and NSXTASY on nsxprime need to get together. You both offer a wealth of knowledge, but your people skills, for lack of better terms, suck.

Thanks again for the help....

Tom M'Guinn

tomc,

Glad you got it sorted out. I have to use a big bar too to turn my motor. There are many ways to find tdc. Sound likes your method was fine. Don't worry about SoCal. His comments reflect much worse on himself than on you. Your questions were fine. I agree about getting the belts re-checked if this was your first time, especially without the factory tension tool to guide you.

keith

I agree on the name calling.

BTW, you can also look down into the inspection hole on the TOP of the bellhousing for a little line and the "OT" mark to find TDC.

SoCal Driver

If I have to apear to "suck" by thumping you in the head to get your attention them so be it. I could have just walked away from this thread and left you to your own devices after your first deer in the head lights reply. For some reason I figured there was a bit of hope.

I might just think twice next time.

Now to finish this thread.

The reason you were out of timining is the cam goes around twice for each turn of the crank. It's also very possible that the balance shaft belt failure caused the timing belt to jump some teeth. Hopefully this did not cause any bent valves.

Take the timing belt off and rotate the cam a bit then rotate the engine a bit till you get the TDC mark and the cam mark to line up. Take out the spark plugs and stuff some loose rags in the holes so you are not fighting against the compression. Once these line up put the flywheel lock on.

I've posted a graphic on how the balance shaft belt lines up several times. Search for my recent posts.