Powder Coating
04-23-2005, 08:58 PM
#32
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Originally Posted by Helstrm
Spit it out...
ok, back on track: Yellow is the hardest color there is to shoot. It doesn't matter on the brand of powder, it just comes out light. A trick pro painters have used for years is to put down a white base coat, then coat with yellow over it, and with yellow powder this means a REALLY HEAVY coat of yellow (turn the mixture way rich). Coat the crevace areas first, then move out from there. You want to keep the gun 8-12" away from the part for even coverage, and follow the same techniques as a painter. It takes practice to get good.
When curing, leave the part hanging if you can. setting it down like you did surely put several marks in it, but good news for you, you can mix some MEK with some powder in a dixie cup and use a touch up brush to get the marks covered.
The bottom line is the stuff you get for home really isn't that great, and you'd more than likely be better off using a very durable paint, and wet coating the parts. you can get a good gun and seperator for a few hundred bucks, versus a good powder coating setup for many thousands of dollars.
As far as powder coating headers, don't. the powder will burn on there, and become a huge mess to get off. If you're going to ceramic coat them, take it to someone who does it. Our shop also did header coatings, and the technique is about 50x harder than wet painting. I serously doubt the stuff eastwood sells is close to what we used, seeing as how the stuff we used cost about $800 per gallon.
Cliffs notes:
1. get the stuff CLEAN
2. use good equipment
3. practice practice practice.
4. you'll have better results taking it to a pro.
04-23-2005, 09:12 PM
#33
Burning Brakes
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Great expert advice! (esp the part about MEK to touch up spots! I have to try that!!)
I've done quite a few parts that came out more than fine for my purposes, i.e. suspension parts, small brackets, etc...I don't think the diy jobs are going to win too many car shows, but for a wide range of projects they turn out a very nice result. It takes some practice though to get it right.
In Helstrm's defense, he did say this was his first project. To an expert, the coverage might look terrible, to the 99.9% of the rest of us it looks pretty darn good!
I've done quite a few parts that came out more than fine for my purposes, i.e. suspension parts, small brackets, etc...I don't think the diy jobs are going to win too many car shows, but for a wide range of projects they turn out a very nice result. It takes some practice though to get it right.
In Helstrm's defense, he did say this was his first project. To an expert, the coverage might look terrible, to the 99.9% of the rest of us it looks pretty darn good!
04-23-2005, 11:19 PM
#34
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I think he can salvage it by scratching off a small bit on the hole he hung it from, then turning the voltage up, and the powder mixture to way rich, and shooting another coat. just be sure to wipe all the fingerprints off. The first time I shot yellow it came out VERY light, and I was like wtf, I laid on 2x the powder and it came out with half the coverage. . . yellow sucks to apply.
04-24-2005, 03:05 AM
#35
The Hoffinator
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i wouldnt suggest bead blasting intakes.. that stuff can be a bitch to clean up inside the manifolds, especially if its somthing as complex as that in pipe design. just think of what those beads do when they get into the heads.. even after yo clean up beads with solvant or compressed air, they are still a pita to get them out. i would definitly suggest chems instead. this is why you shouldnt bead blast anything that comes in contact with oil either (like the oil filter canister on a 356/912, or the oil filler resivouir). just my 2 cents..
04-24-2005, 04:37 AM
#36
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I thought it was common knowledge to mask everywhere you don't want something. If you don't want stuff in your intake, mask it off with a heavy tape. A few plys of duct tape works well.
04-24-2005, 09:01 AM
#37
The Hoffinator
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bead or sand blasting will go right through duct tape in seconds. infact beed blasting, if you hold the nosle at the right angle, will start to burn through the metal.
04-24-2005, 12:19 PM
#40
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Originally Posted by hoffman912
bead or sand blasting will go right through duct tape in seconds. infact beed blasting, if you hold the nosle at the right angle, will start to burn through the metal.
04-24-2005, 04:23 PM
#41
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bleucamaro --
Can you give an example of a model of powder coating gun that you think is a "professional" setup as opposed to the DIY setups, that isn't extremely expensive? What's the minimum you have to spend to get a "decent" gun?
Can you give an example of a model of powder coating gun that you think is a "professional" setup as opposed to the DIY setups, that isn't extremely expensive? What's the minimum you have to spend to get a "decent" gun?
04-24-2005, 05:09 PM
#42
Pro
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by bleucamaro
alrighty. please take no offence, but the coverage on your intake is terrible. you can see the light spots in the pic. being a monday morning quarterback, I would have told you that if you're going to do it at home, to blast with either aluminum oxide or garnet. Never use sand because the silica Fs up any chance of good adhesion. . If you don't have access to a blast cabnet, then use a good degreaser (aircraft degreaser or brake cleaner works well). After you blast, never handle with your bare hands. the oils in your hands will show through the powder. Wipe the part free of dust using MEK, IPA, or a paint thinner that leaves no residue. Cast parts often need to be outgassed (oils will come out of cast metals when curing), meaning that after you clean them, bring them up to cure temp for about an hour, allow them to cool, and wipe again with MEK or your favorite solvent. Now the tricky part. When you setup your gun, you need to have a good ground on the part, and you need to set the voltage on the gun so the powder sticks. In your pic, it looks like you could use both more flow, and more voltage. The gun we used was a GEMA was very expensive. The powder needs to be fluidized, and vibrating beds don't work to well. We used a hopper with a pourous membrane to aerate the powder. It looked like liquid when the top was pulled off. The air you use is also very critical. when you compress air, it also compresses the water in it, and traps help, but don't get it all. We used an air dryer, and aftercooler to get the water out of the system. You also need some sort of collecter or booth to catch all that powder thats going everywhere. I'll bet your neibors will love you when they see red and yellow specks in their black paint.
ok, back on track: Yellow is the hardest color there is to shoot. It doesn't matter on the brand of powder, it just comes out light. A trick pro painters have used for years is to put down a white base coat, then coat with yellow over it, and with yellow powder this means a REALLY HEAVY coat of yellow (turn the mixture way rich). Coat the crevace areas first, then move out from there. You want to keep the gun 8-12" away from the part for even coverage, and follow the same techniques as a painter. It takes practice to get good.
When curing, leave the part hanging if you can. setting it down like you did surely put several marks in it, but good news for you, you can mix some MEK with some powder in a dixie cup and use a touch up brush to get the marks covered.
The bottom line is the stuff you get for home really isn't that great, and you'd more than likely be better off using a very durable paint, and wet coating the parts. you can get a good gun and seperator for a few hundred bucks, versus a good powder coating setup for many thousands of dollars.
As far as powder coating headers, don't. the powder will burn on there, and become a huge mess to get off. If you're going to ceramic coat them, take it to someone who does it. Our shop also did header coatings, and the technique is about 50x harder than wet painting. I serously doubt the stuff eastwood sells is close to what we used, seeing as how the stuff we used cost about $800 per gallon.
Cliffs notes:
1. get the stuff CLEAN
2. use good equipment
3. practice practice practice.
4. you'll have better results taking it to a pro.
ok, back on track: Yellow is the hardest color there is to shoot. It doesn't matter on the brand of powder, it just comes out light. A trick pro painters have used for years is to put down a white base coat, then coat with yellow over it, and with yellow powder this means a REALLY HEAVY coat of yellow (turn the mixture way rich). Coat the crevace areas first, then move out from there. You want to keep the gun 8-12" away from the part for even coverage, and follow the same techniques as a painter. It takes practice to get good.
When curing, leave the part hanging if you can. setting it down like you did surely put several marks in it, but good news for you, you can mix some MEK with some powder in a dixie cup and use a touch up brush to get the marks covered.
The bottom line is the stuff you get for home really isn't that great, and you'd more than likely be better off using a very durable paint, and wet coating the parts. you can get a good gun and seperator for a few hundred bucks, versus a good powder coating setup for many thousands of dollars.
As far as powder coating headers, don't. the powder will burn on there, and become a huge mess to get off. If you're going to ceramic coat them, take it to someone who does it. Our shop also did header coatings, and the technique is about 50x harder than wet painting. I serously doubt the stuff eastwood sells is close to what we used, seeing as how the stuff we used cost about $800 per gallon.
Cliffs notes:
1. get the stuff CLEAN
2. use good equipment
3. practice practice practice.
4. you'll have better results taking it to a pro.
I use aluminum oxide and that was the first coating I have done... http://rr-raceworks.com This link will show you my latest work. The yellow intake was one thin coat but since then has been stripped and redone. Looks great now. I have down 6 928 intakes a dozen 944 cam towers and several guns so I have gotten much better at it. I also have a better gun and we do hang the parts. But on that intake it did not matter because you will never see the bottom. For the most part I have been very happy with the results of the latest work and if I am not happy I start over...
04-25-2005, 02:32 AM
#43
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Originally Posted by Darren
bleucamaro --
Can you give an example of a model of powder coating gun that you think is a "professional" setup as opposed to the DIY setups, that isn't extremely expensive? What's the minimum you have to spend to get a "decent" gun?
Can you give an example of a model of powder coating gun that you think is a "professional" setup as opposed to the DIY setups, that isn't extremely expensive? What's the minimum you have to spend to get a "decent" gun?
and a good hand gun, http://www.itwgema.com/products/appl...asysystem.html although ours weren't this new, maybe used ones can be found on ebay or an industrial sales site.
04-25-2005, 10:27 PM
#44
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Listen to blucamaro , he is right on on the methods and $ involved. He pointed out some things that are most often overlooked by the DIY. Grounds , dust , oil and solvent free surfaces, and booths as this stuff gets everywhere, moisture free air supply and on and on .Alum has to be preheated and then allowed to cool to get rid of gasses in the metals surface , etc etc. and of course what you start out with in surface finish is what you wind up with. We built our booths from 4 x12 steel sheets, triple lined , and electric heat coils , several fans for convection style heating. For the DIY who just wants to play around and have the hands on fun is one thing , but if you want a concours part , take it to a pro shop that does it . Its cheaper in the long run.
04-25-2005, 10:36 PM
#45
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Brian , I'm retired now and will be giving the control of the business to my niece who does all the research .She is really calling all the shots now with my blessing and my Grands are becoming more important as time goes by so I look forward to my trips out there. I am happy to see you still have that ride you promised me and if it were mine I probably would just put it away with the other car you know of. I remember when you started your project and I said to you , whatever makes you happy and I wish you that now. Best of luck kiddo.