fast951

"IF" the turbo is leaking on the turbine section, oil will deposit on the exhaust and will burn once hot. Also thinner oil tend to drain more. Under boost the exhaust pressure tends to make the turbo leak less, but sooner or later it will change and smoke will be 100% of the time.
Check the shaft for excessive play, stop driving if there is lots of play.

Obviously it's impossible to diagnose a engine via emails, so investigate a bit further before you start replacing parts.

If you replace te turbo, make sure you follow the turbo supplier recommendation for priming the turbo. First few minutes of the turbo life determine if it will live or fail.

rage2

Here's what I was told, dunno if there's truth to it, but it makes sense.

At idle, there's crankcase pressure, it's easier for the oil to seep out the seals into the intake/exhaust path, which causes the smoke. When you drive hard, your PCV is sucking hard out of the crankcase, which in turn helps the oil drain. At part throttle, there's light vaccuum in the crankcase, and enough to help the turbo drain. I guess if the seals are really bad, it'll smoke at part throttle too. Oil takes the path of least resistance.

Vitesse John can probably confirm if this is right or wrong. For now, I just drive like a maniac to not pollute the environment .

fast951

If the crankcase pressure is high (due to bad rings, or the case is not venting properly), the turbo will not drain properly and will flood causing lots of smoke.
Those running a catch can should connect the can to the J-pipe for suction..

Zero10

I didn't run the quarter mile, I went over there at 12:15 or so, and they were shut down
I got 4 or 5 runs in on the Auto-x though.
I was hoping to top 100mph on the quarter mile, but I didn't get a chance... Maybe next time. It would be neat to put one of those stickers in my window

rage2

They need 110 or 120mph stickers, those are the only ones that means something .

I'll be there again Friday Canada day, stop by and say hi. I'll either be driving the Civic down the drag strip again, or autox'ing my AMG.

special tool

Absolutely 120 would be damn good - especially when you are halfway to the ozone layer like you 2 are.

IanM

I started the car last night and let it sit there at idle until it reached operating temperature. After about 10 minutes some blue smoke started to come out the tailpipe. I turned off the car and removed the i/c pipe from the turbo to the intercooler - it was bone dry, no sign of any oil. I removed the spark plugs and inspected. All look good except #4, which was wet, black, and carbon fouled. I did a compression test - 155/145/145/140. So #4 was down slightly. I'm leaning heavily towards valve guide stem seals. Motor is still quite fresh from rebuild, I'm hoping a seal just popped off a guide.

Is it possible for a seal on the turbine side of the turbo to allow oil directly into the exhaust? Or does leaking turbo seals normally cause oil to be drawn through the compressor and into the i/c pipes?

special tool

Ian - yes, especially when you do not have sufficient crankcase vacuum.
This vacuum was designed to help pull the oil down the turbo drain.
If you have a crank vac problem, the oil will build up in the turbo and slip past exhaust seals (ESPECIALLY SYNTHETIC OIL)

jimbo1111

I had this problem on my other car/ turbo. A restrictor helps. In my case it eliminated the problem. It may have to do with the fact that our engines run higher oil pressure than most. I spoke to a turbo manufacturer once that said these turbos have dynamic seals. If there is no exhaust pressure on the seals they relax and the higher oil pressure of our cars overwelm the seals holding capacity. The oil than will leak into the exhaust housing and burn off. Without a restrictor the oil will cake on to the blades and housing. The new turbo I use doesn't leak a drop. It comes from a much better turbo builder. The cost is higher. The tolerances are much better and worth every penny not to see smoke pouring out of the exhaust when decelerating or idling. If your picky like I am than don't buy inferior turbos.

IanM

Thanks guys. I'm going to inspect the #4 cylinder first, since the fouled plug indicates a problem there anyways. After that I'll move onto the turbo if smoke is still an issue.

Please advise at to where to pick up an intake oil restrictor for the turbo, and what size is recommended.

Eyal 951

If its any help, I have the same issue about. I notice after running the car, not everytime, usually spirited, it will smoke a bunch at idle out of the exhaust. If I shut off the car, and start it up again (even right away) it no longer really smokes. I'm suspecting the k26/6 is not in the best shape. Its got lots of play, and I beleive it was a pull of from a race car, so its upgrade time real soon. It also could be something like the OAS, or the fact that my dipstick would vibrate out.
~Eyal

special tool

Eyal - with your dipstick problem YOU IN PARTICULAR need to review my posts about crankcase pressure.

Danno

"or the fact that my dipstick would vibrate out."

Huh? How can the dipstick back out? It's bolted in place...

"I started the car last night and let it sit there at idle until it reached operating temperature. After about 10 minutes some blue smoke started to come out the tailpipe."

Try this same test again, but leave the oil-filler cap off. See if it starts to smoke after 10 minutes. I've got a cap with a nipple on it to measure actual crankcase pressures. Then you know for sure exactly what the crankcase pressure is..

tammons

If not the #4 cyl or crankcase pressurization, its probably due to oil blowing past the seal into the turbo exhaust housing. How old is the turbo. Is it new. Also what kind of oil. I built a couple of turbo 928's and they both would blow oil past the exhaust seals on cold startup. The first car was twin T3's and I ended up having to run a restrictor. The starting oil pressure was much too high, but one thing that helped is I had the builder setup the seals tight on the T3's. After about a year I ended up blowing some sort of gunk into one of the oil seals and it got pretty bad until i had them rebuilt.

The second was a single T4 car. Same thing. Had to run a restrictor. That turbo was rebuilt, and no matter what I did or what oil it would smoke until I set up a restrictor.

Also sometimes depending on the oil pressure a new turbo will smoke with synthetic oil for the first few thousand miles.

My 2 cents anyway.

Zero10

If the oil was coming from the exhaust side of the turbo, why is the #4 plug oily?....

I have the same situation. If I am driving hard, and it starts to blow oil big-time, my I/C pipes are dry. My K26/6 seems to be in perfect condition (i.e. no shaft play in any direction), but I suppose that doesn't mean the seals are good. I think mine MAY be a head problem, but it burns quite a bit of oil. How much oil are you guys going through?

Rage, I hate to say it, but a beat-up civic isn't an uncommon site at secret street I might not be able to find you too easily. I'll post here tomorrow if I'm going to go this friday. Do you think it will be really busy like last week? I'll most likely run the Auto-x for most of the night, with a couple early quarter-mile passes. I might run the Auto-x to show some new guys the course first though.

If you're looking for me, I have the smokey 951 It's nautic blue metallic, driver's side rocker panel is caved in pretty bad, door is dented as well. Other than that, it's in nice shape. If you're auto-x'ing a lot, and I come out, it'll be hard to miss me.