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im confused. so you think AR-1 is slower than MPSC2, but only for first 10-20 laps?
I am wrestling with MPSC2 vs AR-1. Have two sets of rims, one set shod with AR-1 the other with MPSC2...
I initially thought that the AR-1 were quicker than the MPSC2... but now I am rethinking that maybe they are more similar, but I do think AR-1 lasts longer.
the AR-1 *SUCKS* on the street, really loud, and a lot of harmonics thorough the car at like 65-72MPH... my car is just for the track, but I do drive it there.
this
Originally Posted by kart driver
Tried the AR-1 again the next day and was not happy with them although they became more balanced during day two. The lap time became a bit better - 0.3 sec.
Then took the AR-1 off and put on Cup2s. Immediately shaved 0.6 seconds per lap on CUP2s. Cup2s are also very balanced and very predictable.
Yes I know cup2s will be faster for the first 10-20 laps and then lose lap time gradually and the AR-1 are holding its lap time for many laps. But the AR-1 tire is a no go for me. Will not buy those again. Rubbish.
Last edited by kart driver; 09-09-2021 at 07:26 AM.
Excellent report Stealth! I will definitely consider the CR-1's for my next set of tires. I autox on Cup 2's and like them, but could use a bit more grip to be more competitive with guys on AR-1's and Yoko's.
Had a WET, and by wet, I mean the track was a flowing river. Drive to the track was wet, with just a little standing water. They did fine on the streets and felt comfortable.
55deg, windy, steady rain, standing/flowing water just about everywhere. These tires are not so good. I lost to people on A052's. The car was sliding all over the place and there was almost no traction.
However, it was way been then on Cup2's.
Sadly I didn't; get the opportunity to drive them in just the wet. I know there will be ample time to do so before the end of the year. Rain like this is kind of rare in the PNW, we are more overcast and light rain. Not this kind. On the way home form the AX it was raining so badly the wiper on high were not clearing the windshield. During normal driving the were good, only a little hydroplaning and they felt fine.
Here's the key to the CR-S (formerly the CR-1) scroll down and read the break in procedure. https://philstireservice.com/shop/nankang-cr-s/
Talked with Phil's and teams are winning on the CR-S following the above break in procedure. 8 hours on one set. On Miata's, BMW's, front wheel drive Honda's, so far. In many cases faster than the AO52 (faster consistent lap times) with longer life.
Was AR1 last season, started this season on CR-S and prefer them
Originally Posted by David Borden
Congrats on the results and great report, thank you for taking the time to write that up. I was really encouraged by the street manners you reported. I have been told the AR1 is not a nice tire on the street.
hey all, and hi David, RJ here - missed you at TH this past Saturday.
Weighing in on the CR-S. I’m driving a 2012.5 991.1 S cab. Last AX season (my first season in this car) I ran the AR-1 in 265/305 on 19’s. This season I’ve started on the CR-S in 245/305 on the same 19’s. Camber is -2.8f -2.5r.
so far I prefer the CR-S. Perhaps the AR-1 had a tad more grip at the edge of it, and I had more bite on turn in, but that was likely due to 265 vs 245 in the fronts. But they had grip and then they didn’t. Not much feedback before they let go. And I didn’t really like the way they felt mid turn - so perhaps the slip angle wasn’t really to my liking. For street driving they are silly loud. But I was competitive with the PCA folks in the SF Bay Area - well competitive with those that aren’t the National Ranked types.
This season I started on the CR-S. I now have 6 events at ~10 runs per on a few different surfaces from the wide open fast paced sticky stuff at Crows Landing, to a poor quality surface in the parking lot at Cow Palace, to a great smooth surface up at Thunderhill. In all cases I have greatly improved feel and feedback from these tires. I love the way the handle in the turn, completely predictable and doing exactly what I want. I may have a tad more understeer than last season - again the 265 down to 245 may be at play, but I’m comfortable with the setup and able to move fast.
they heat up very fast, and really by second run I’m all in. Regular street manners in driving to and from events are amazing - as in I would happily drive these as my daily tires.
I’m hopeful I get a full 10 events in before these start falling off the pace - will see - and will also see what kind of fall off curve they have. I did have Phil heat cycyle them, and I did my best to follow his burn in process without actually taking them to a course - but some spirited back roading then let them chill for a day before first real event. Supposedly that helps performance and longevity.
I’ve just ordered up a second set so I’ll have them in the garage and ready to go when I start to see my times less competitive than where I am today. so yeah, I’m all in on these tires for this season. Just pulled TTOD this past Saturday and been performing well right from the jump of the season so I’m gonna stick with these for now.
hey all, and hi David, RJ here - missed you at TH this past Saturday.
Weighing in on the CR-S. I’m driving a 2012.5 991.1 S cab. Last AX season (my first season in this car) I ran the AR-1 in 265/305 on 19’s. This season I’ve started on the CR-S in 245/305 on the same 19’s. Camber is -2.8f -2.5r.
so far I prefer the CR-S. Perhaps the AR-1 had a tad more grip at the edge of it, and I had more bite on turn in, but that was likely due to 265 vs 245 in the fronts. But they had grip and then they didn’t. Not much feedback before they let go. And I didn’t really like the way they felt mid turn - so perhaps the slip angle wasn’t really to my liking. For street driving they are silly loud. But I was competitive with the PCA folks in the SF Bay Area - well competitive with those that aren’t the National Ranked types.
This season I started on the CR-S. I now have 6 events at ~10 runs per on a few different surfaces from the wide open fast paced sticky stuff at Crows Landing, to a poor quality surface in the parking lot at Cow Palace, to a great smooth surface up at Thunderhill. In all cases I have greatly improved feel and feedback from these tires. I love the way the handle in the turn, completely predictable and doing exactly what I want. I may have a tad more understeer than last season - again the 265 down to 245 may be at play, but I’m comfortable with the setup and able to move fast.
they heat up very fast, and really by second run I’m all in. Regular street manners in driving to and from events are amazing - as in I would happily drive these as my daily tires.
I’m hopeful I get a full 10 events in before these start falling off the pace - will see - and will also see what kind of fall off curve they have. I did have Phil heat cycyle them, and I did my best to follow his burn in process without actually taking them to a course - but some spirited back roading then let them chill for a day before first real event. Supposedly that helps performance and longevity.
I’ve just ordered up a second set so I’ll have them in the garage and ready to go when I start to see my times less competitive than where I am today. so yeah, I’m all in on these tires for this season. Just pulled TTOD this past Saturday and been performing well right from the jump of the season so I’m gonna stick with these for now.
Cheers,
RJ Harrison
Funny, I got quite a few friends heading down to Crows landing for SCCA in the next couple weeks. I got 150+ runs out of my set, the rears were almost on the cords, and rear grip was falling way off, especially in the rain.
It's important to keep track and air temps in mind when comparing tires. I may have loved Cup2's if I lived in the Bay Area, but in the PNW, they suck most of the time.
Also the AR-1 will most likely last a lot longer in AX, take longer to heat up, but maintain heat and grip better, they are most likely illegal for most "stock" type classes. Same with my Cup2's I was protested at a SCCA event for having them. Then after switched to CR-1s and now I'm 3sec faster than the person who protested me..
After this current set I burned off, thinking about going bigger from 245/305 to 255/315, but as you found out it's important to keep the F/R balance, you either get a ton of understeer or overseer.
09-09-2021, 07:24 AM
