GM voids warranty for flipped cars (Z06, etc) Could this help Porsche GT3 buyers too?
07-31-2022, 09:19 AM
#1
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Thread Starter
GM voids warranty for flipped cars (Z06, etc) Could this help Porsche GT3 buyers too?
https://jalopnik.com/gm-will-cancel-your-warranty-if-you-buy-your-z06-from-a-1849350024
I still pine for a 991.2 or 992 gt3 to replace my 997 gt3.
Really kills me that the market demands ADM.
Also think flippers making a GT3 profit are negatively affecting this market.
You guys think Porsche might follow GMs lead regarding Hummer and Z06 warranty cancellation for flipped cars?
I still pine for a 991.2 or 992 gt3 to replace my 997 gt3.
Really kills me that the market demands ADM.
Also think flippers making a GT3 profit are negatively affecting this market.
You guys think Porsche might follow GMs lead regarding Hummer and Z06 warranty cancellation for flipped cars?
Last edited by balefire; 07-31-2022 at 09:22 AM.
07-31-2022, 09:36 AM
#2
I like it. Smart move from GM.
These changes are being implemented to ensure an exemplary customer experience, to ensure our brands remain strong, and to help prioritize ownership by brand enthusiasts and loyal customers.
These changes are being implemented to ensure an exemplary customer experience, to ensure our brands remain strong, and to help prioritize ownership by brand enthusiasts and loyal customers.
07-31-2022, 03:49 PM
#3
Rennlist Member
If I was cynical Id think they might be out to save $$$ from warranty claims flying the false flag of looking after the true enthusiast. Could backfire and cause secondhand value to tank!
07-31-2022, 03:58 PM
#4
RL Community Team
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That's not enforceable.
Federal law dictates that the OEM warranty is associated with the car (VIN) and transfers to successive owners until the warranty’s expiration date.
I'm guessing even GM isn't as stupid to not know this as the letter carefully says ... "we are limiting the transferability of certain warranties" (emphasis added).
Federal law dictates that the OEM warranty is associated with the car (VIN) and transfers to successive owners until the warranty’s expiration date.
I'm guessing even GM isn't as stupid to not know this as the letter carefully says ... "we are limiting the transferability of certain warranties" (emphasis added).
Last edited by ipse dixit; 07-31-2022 at 04:00 PM.
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07-31-2022, 04:55 PM
#5
That's not enforceable.
Federal law dictates that the OEM warranty is associated with the car (VIN) and transfers to successive owners until the warranty’s expiration date.
I'm guessing even GM isn't as stupid to not know this as the letter carefully says ... "we are limiting the transferability of certain warranties" (emphasis added).
Federal law dictates that the OEM warranty is associated with the car (VIN) and transfers to successive owners until the warranty’s expiration date.
I'm guessing even GM isn't as stupid to not know this as the letter carefully says ... "we are limiting the transferability of certain warranties" (emphasis added).
08-01-2022, 01:10 PM
#7
Three Wheelin'
GM wears white hat, federal law black hat.
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08-01-2022, 01:24 PM
#8
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One of the dumbest things I have ever heard - if you buy a car 1) who can dictate whether you sell it or not 2) how can you legally void a warranty for a product based on a sale. If you want to limit flipping - preferably make more so supply is closer to demand or lease only for X years followed by option to purchase, or charge more so manufacturers keep more of the profit. Porsche is doing the latter with the sport classic. MSRP of $275K plus options - no?
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Taffy66 (08-01-2022)
08-01-2022, 01:59 PM
#9
GM has the right to independently develop every facet of its auto warranty program, including whether it offers one at all. Don't know law that would forbid it from making certain warranties non-transferable.
At any point seems an automotive manufacturer could stipulate that the warranty applies to the original owner, and no subsequent owners, i.e., non-transferable. Happens in many industries.
Happy to be proven wrong with legal citation(s).
At any point seems an automotive manufacturer could stipulate that the warranty applies to the original owner, and no subsequent owners, i.e., non-transferable. Happens in many industries.
Happy to be proven wrong with legal citation(s).
08-01-2022, 05:09 PM
#10
GM has the right to independently develop every facet of its auto warranty program, including whether it offers one at all. Don't know law that would forbid it from making certain warranties non-transferable.
At any point seems an automotive manufacturer could stipulate that the warranty applies to the original owner, and no subsequent owners, i.e., non-transferable. Happens in many industries.
Happy to be proven wrong with legal citation(s).
At any point seems an automotive manufacturer could stipulate that the warranty applies to the original owner, and no subsequent owners, i.e., non-transferable. Happens in many industries.
Happy to be proven wrong with legal citation(s).
^^^^ The reality.
08-01-2022, 08:01 PM
#11
Three Wheelin'
GM is on potentially shaky ground with the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act and other State and Federal Law related to commerce, restraint of trade, and possibly others. As others have stated limited warranties are common but the specific models in the letter come with full warranty which is only voided (non transferable) based on the time of ownership and purchase location, nothing related to use/abuse. GM’s policy may be targeting flippers but the only one affected is the purchaser who in effect is being told buy from who GM tells you or else. The Act now prevents automatic voiding of warranty for non dealer service and use of non OEM parts unless proven to have caused damages claimed under warranty. This includes aftermarket parts as well. Litigation may not be cheap but people have sued deep pocket automakers for less.
“The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act prohibits product manufacturers from conditioning consumer warranties on the use of any original equipment part or service. Furthermore, a manufacturer can only deny warranty coverage if it can demonstrate that a non-original equipment part or related service caused a defect to occur in the original product. In the case of motor vehicles, new car manufacturers have ignored these conditions outlined in Magnuson-Moss and have misled consumers to believe that they must have dealer service shops install only original equipment replacement parts or fear having their new car warranty voided.”
“The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act prohibits product manufacturers from conditioning consumer warranties on the use of any original equipment part or service. Furthermore, a manufacturer can only deny warranty coverage if it can demonstrate that a non-original equipment part or related service caused a defect to occur in the original product. In the case of motor vehicles, new car manufacturers have ignored these conditions outlined in Magnuson-Moss and have misled consumers to believe that they must have dealer service shops install only original equipment replacement parts or fear having their new car warranty voided.”
Last edited by djcxxx; 08-01-2022 at 08:15 PM.
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rodsky (08-02-2022)
08-01-2022, 08:28 PM
#12
RL Community Team
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GM is on potentially shaky ground with the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act and other State and Federal Law related to commerce, restraint of trade, and possibly others. As others have stated limited warranties are common but the specific models in the letter come with full warranty which is only voided (non transferable) based on the time of ownership and purchase location, nothing related to use/abuse. GM’s policy may be targeting flippers but the only one affected is the purchaser who in effect is being told buy from who GM tells you or else. The Act now prevents automatic voiding of warranty for non dealer service and use of non OEM parts unless proven to have caused damages claimed under warranty. This includes aftermarket parts as well. Litigation may not be cheap but people have sued deep pocket automakers for less.
“The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act prohibits product manufacturers from conditioning consumer warranties on the use of any original equipment part or service. Furthermore, a manufacturer can only deny warranty coverage if it can demonstrate that a non-original equipment part or related service caused a defect to occur in the original product. In the case of motor vehicles, new car manufacturers have ignored these conditions outlined in Magnuson-Moss and have misled consumers to believe that they must have dealer service shops install only original equipment replacement parts or fear having their new car warranty voided.”
“The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act prohibits product manufacturers from conditioning consumer warranties on the use of any original equipment part or service. Furthermore, a manufacturer can only deny warranty coverage if it can demonstrate that a non-original equipment part or related service caused a defect to occur in the original product. In the case of motor vehicles, new car manufacturers have ignored these conditions outlined in Magnuson-Moss and have misled consumers to believe that they must have dealer service shops install only original equipment replacement parts or fear having their new car warranty voided.”
I, for one, would love to see GM try to enforce a "if you sell, warrant is void" type of provision.
It would mean lots of legal work for lawyers.
More work for lawyers (on either side of the "V") is always good for my industry.
08-01-2022, 09:53 PM
#13
Racer
I don't think the Moss Magnusson act is really applicable here. That law is aimed at companies denying warranty claims due to independent auto service or aftermarket parts.
GM is simply limiting the transferability of the warranty. Iirc, BMW does something similar with their CPO warranties. If you buy a CPO BMW from the dealer, then sell it to someone else, the CPO warranty doesn't transfer to the new owner. That was a change from how they used to handle CPO warranties.
I'm sure there'll be some disgruntled customers when they have a legit need to sell a car before they had planned and end up taking a bath on resale. Or when an unsuspecting customers buys a second hand Z06, has something break, then finds out they have zero warranty. Will be interesting to see whether it's a net positive for GM.
GM is simply limiting the transferability of the warranty. Iirc, BMW does something similar with their CPO warranties. If you buy a CPO BMW from the dealer, then sell it to someone else, the CPO warranty doesn't transfer to the new owner. That was a change from how they used to handle CPO warranties.
I'm sure there'll be some disgruntled customers when they have a legit need to sell a car before they had planned and end up taking a bath on resale. Or when an unsuspecting customers buys a second hand Z06, has something break, then finds out they have zero warranty. Will be interesting to see whether it's a net positive for GM.
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balefire (08-02-2022)
08-01-2022, 10:30 PM
#14
Instructor
The thought process of the second buyer might be …
Nobody has a promise that tomorrow will come, I have deep pockets and really don’t care if I have a warranty I want the car!
With that being said, I think flipping will continue
Nobody has a promise that tomorrow will come, I have deep pockets and really don’t care if I have a warranty I want the car!
With that being said, I think flipping will continue
08-01-2022, 10:35 PM
#15
Why choose 12 months? Many people don’t hang on to cars that long and they aren’t flippers. Could be 3-4 months or even mileage based within 12 months or something.