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I'm taking delivery of a GT4 RS at the end of December and I'm looking for a 992 GT3 owner (in Northern California Ideally) to come drive with us so we can film a comparison video of the two cars. You would have access to driving the GT4 RS all day while we filmed the GT3 and get to experience that. We're also going to be renting out Thunderhill 2 or 3 mile in February or March for a private track day to film an on-track comparison video with real lap times. You would again be able to drive the GT4 RS (and your GT3) on a completely empty track. You would just need to get to the location and pay for lodging.
If anyone is interested or knows someone who might be, please comment here or private message.
Thanks! Chase (Car Honey)
P.S. Photos of the allocation attached (Shark Blue, Weissach, and White Gold Wheels).
It's difficult to answer. The 992 GT3 has removed most of the 911 character "flaws" with clever electronics and a new front end. The GT4, relative to the <992 generation GT3s...generally...requires less braking, less trail braking, going into corners. It rotates easier given it's lower PMI. However, is has far less rear grip post mid corner. Practically, when I drive it, I charge much harder into corners achieving higher min speeds, and gather it up midcorner and try to exit gracefully. Requires less left-foot braking to move grip around, I find that throttle works great given how fast the car responds to input. GT4 has so little HP relative to the GT3, that while the rear grip is lower, it's not easy to overpower it on corner exit (4RS may be something different). At the limit, the cayman platform can be a handfull. The front/rear McPherson suspension architecture has a camber/roll curve disadvantage that can bite you in the *** (essentially while you are loading the car, you are adding bad positive camber on the corner with the most load, it gets worse with the more roll - non linear and can surprise you). 997/991 GT3, you slow more into the corners, trail brake more to get it to rotate because of it's much higher PMI and location of the weight. Min speeds are quite a bit lower - but one you are ready for acceleration, it has superior grip. Once you are on power, the platform has superior stability (as long s you don't lift)...you are unlikely to spin a 911 while on the power. If you need to move weight onto the nose in the corner, left foot braking works better than modulating the throttle - it needs more force as input to make it react. This also manifests as being more difficult to sense and correct with minor changes - when you upset a 911, its more difficult to sense and more difficult to recover than a cayman - again cayman has a lower PMI so easier to drive. 992 front end and whatever electronics tuning they have done with rear steer has fixed corner entry. You can charge in as hard or harder than the GT4, cayman no longer has an advantage here. While corner entry on the 997/991 needed a different style than most other cars, the 992 it just does what you tell it. It's whe most of the speed improvements come from on the 992 over the 991 (setting aside the 150% more aero for a second). Those are my observations after about 10K in each of a 997RS, GT4 and the 992.
MANY reviews written on 992 but THIS IS THE SHORTEST AND THE MOST WELL written one.
I have had a lot of. cayman gt4 and cS. I hear ppl tell me GT4 handles better, it's a go kart, blah blah
well, they are not driving it hard.
at limit GT4 is MUCH harder to drive than any 911.
and 992 as you said, no longer behave like what we are used to.
it does what you ask it to do, you still have to DRIVE it, but it will not argue with you.
front grips like FWD so you can enter turn fast
rear grips like old 911 at exit
mid corner is like go kart
some say it's easier to drive. well maybe, maybe not...
if you can really drive. you will want this car...
I sold my 4.0 b/c 992 !
and this car is brilliant at 20mph as it is at 150mph...
I like it so much I sold my dually and suv...
b/c I don't want to drive anything else. if stuff don't fit in my 992... well I guess I don't need that....
I’m in SoCal. Could make the trip if you don’t find a NorCal person.
Thanks Michael, that's quite the offer! Thunderhill is a few hours North of the Bay Area so even further. Do you track your GT3? I'll shoot you a private message now with my Cell
Thanks Michael, that's quite the offer! Thunderhill is a few hours North of the Bay Area so even further. Do you track your GT3? I'll shoot you a private message now with my Cell
My impressions after a month of seat time in the 4RS and 6 months of time in the 992 GT3.
1. If you had to pick one, you'd go with the GT3 all day. No, it's not as visceral but the ride is better, the front turn in / steering feel is substantially better and it's all around more livable. I just repeated the "DOH" items -- but it bears repeating.
2. The 4RS is crazy fun with the air intake sound in the cabin. Ridiculous. The first time you downshift from 3rd to 2nd above 5k RPM and get this new "WHAP" sound on blip you actually LOL. It's intoxicating.
3. The 4RS has the more analog interior / buttons / instrumentation of the 991.2 911's/GT3s. Personally, I thought it was great and still prefer it over the "new" stuff in the 992 GT3.
4. Size wise, the 4RS is perhaps only a 1/2 foot shorter (not even that, really) than the 992 GT3. Neither is a "small/compact" car. So what -- they have had to grow the car to increase the track (mainly width), downforce, etc to keep advancing the performance. Doesn't bother me.
5. I am still breaking in the 4RS - which is a factor. I have seen the videos and can't wait to get into the upper band RPM bands. My understanding is I may need earplugs. Looking forward to that.
6. Both ridiculous cars that all but 5% here will never be able to wring out max performance.
7. If you want a car you can live with forever and still track it (and it's amazing), then it's the GT3.
8. If you wan to grab the keys and have "the g/f experience" every single time you drive, it's the GT4RS.
9. If you and your dealer have a good relationship (you are a repeat customer and allow them to make money off of you), go for both if you can get them.
10. To quote our old friend Ferris Buehler: "I highly recommend it".
My impressions after a month of seat time in the 4RS and 6 months of time in the 992 GT3.
1. If you had to pick one, you'd go with the GT3 all day. No, it's not as visceral but the ride is better, the front turn in / steering feel is substantially better and it's all around more livable. I just repeated the "DOH" items -- but it bears repeating.
2. The 4RS is crazy fun with the air intake sound in the cabin. Ridiculous. The first time you downshift from 3rd to 2nd above 5k RPM and get this new "WHAP" sound on blip you actually LOL. It's intoxicating.
3. The 4RS has the more analog interior / buttons / instrumentation of the 991.2 911's/GT3s. Personally, I thought it was great and still prefer it over the "new" stuff in the 992 GT3.
4. Size wise, the 4RS is perhaps only a 1/2 foot shorter (not even that, really) than the 992 GT3. Neither is a "small/compact" car. So what -- they have had to grow the car to increase the track (mainly width), downforce, etc to keep advancing the performance. Doesn't bother me.
5. I am still breaking in the 4RS - which is a factor. I have seen the videos and can't wait to get into the upper band RPM bands. My understanding is I may need earplugs. Looking forward to that.
6. Both ridiculous cars that all but 5% here will never be able to wring out max performance.
7. If you want a car you can live with forever and still track it (and it's amazing), then it's the GT3.
8. If you wan to grab the keys and have "the g/f experience" every single time you drive, it's the GT4RS.
9. If you and your dealer have a good relationship (you are a repeat customer and allow them to make money off of you), go for both if you can get them.
10. To quote our old friend Ferris Buehler: "I highly recommend it".
;-)
I agree with this - but frankly find the GT4 "too raw" for my tastes (and by-the-way the "taste" of my Porsche instructor/mechanical engineer - when driving the GT4-RS for official work duties to/from various german locations he has a set of personal noise canceling headphones he keeps at work just for GT4 RS duty - as do his co-workers - fact - he said he can't sit in traffic for more than 30-40 minutes in the GT4-RS with out driving him nuts - noise canceling headphones was the answer and the only way he can physically be in the car long enough for some of the trips he has to do for work @ Porsche Germany)
having spent two days in a GT4/RS @ Nurburgring w/Porsche and then getting to drive the GT3 "same day/back to back" on the ring - GT3 all day long vs. GT4 RS - for me the GT4 RS is too "nervous" and I simply do not like the loud cabin due to the air-intakes - it's not a drivable car off track for anything other than spirited driving - dailly duty I can only imagine would be a horrible chore - also the GT4-RS was always in the "wrong" gear on the ring in auto for me personally - once I started driving it full manual it was better - but still lacked a natural "flow" for when/where to shift (again for me personally)…
I then got into the GT3 - and magic - smooth - capable, sublime, confident, and OMG sooo much front end command - bumpy parts of the ring don't exists in the new GT3 - big cabin volumn and while I can hear/command/interpret the flat-6 it's not screaming in my ear for the sake of screaming in my ear…
True Story: Porsche runs 2 day Nurburgring track days - these are wonderful affairs well run, high end, fantastic experience - I highly recommend - normally two a year - one in spring and one in summer - I attended summer 2022 - ran in some Rennlisters that I know - who do it this frequently- and they are part of a group of Porsche/Enthusiasts who do the Ring this way when ever they can - and have done it a lot - Porsche offers rentals and about 80-90% of the cars at these events are typically factory rentals from Porsche directly - Many in this group were excited, thrilled, and over the moon to have been able to rent the GT4-RS for the spring 2022 date @ the ring (10 or more high-end porsche customers from all over world and various industries - hard core customers - long time customers - lots of seat time on tracks) - Not a single one of them rented the GT4-RS for the Summer 2022 ring event - all of them opt'd for either the GT3 or their own vehicle - for a few it went further - they cancled their GT4-RS orders (very very few) but none the less some - 2 days @ the ring in a GT4 RS and none of them wanted to return to it when given the choice (and a small savings in rental cost). They all smiled and told me they would be interested in my impressions after day 1 when they found out I was in a GT4 RS the night before day 1…
one of the major problems with the GT4-RS is the GT3's existence. But it's like the iphone 14 vs. iphone 14 pro - the iPhone 14 is a great phone by any measure, but then again there is in fact a Pro version - it doesn't make the 14 bad, but it's less capable by design/market segment…
GT4-RS is hard core track worthy cayman with nothing held back - but the GT3's new front end bigger volume and great suspension simply outclass the GT4-RS in my opinion.
if you want loud & raw - GT4RS
if you want sublime and OMG this is soooo good - GT3
if you want to drive it anywhere other than the track - GT3
for me personally it's no contest - given a choice of one or the other - well I can only have one - so GT3 for me.
Last edited by daveo4porsche; 12-08-2022 at 08:57 AM.
I spent a couple hundred miles in a GT4RS and i've had hours in a couple 992 gt3s with my personal touring coming this week...to me, the gt4rs is levels above in fun factor than the GT3 assuming PDK for PDK. It reminded me of a 918 light, and I've got a 918 so I don't say that lightly. If I had to choose one, id have a 4RS over the GT3, or pretty much any other modern GT car aside from a 911R without a moment of thought needed, but Im looking for the excitement in a drive like that and we're talking about road car usage vs track usage. For a track, both seem to have their strengths, but I do tend to love 911 dynamics over mid engined dynamics so Id likely be in a 911 platform for that, and admittedly the new 992 is a flat out weapon in the grip department. Noise level, the Cayman isn't quiet, and yes there's tire noise but its not nearly as bad as a lot of people seem to make it out to be. You don't have to rev to 9k every shift, and keeping under 7k was actually quieter than I was expecting it to be...though the sound is absolutely UNREAL amazing and is like having a surround sound system blurting out the motor around your face...and its UHHHMMMAAAAAZINGGGG.
As I'm having a bit time at hand due to being paid not to go to work I was again at the Ring during the last NLS race of the season. This time I had the chance to drive the Cayman GT4RS in the racing version toned down to 450hp to fit into the respective class. The last time I drove a Cayman in anger was in 2016 in Spa during the Porsche Sportscup races albeit with a Clubsport model with the 385hp engine.
In the beginning to get to grips with it as it was wet and slippery I limited myself to "Kurzanbindung" of the GP track without the Nordschleife as I haven't driven the Ring for 6 years. Already in the first lap I had to take the emergency exit at the Mühlenbach Schleife and in the second lap I almost spun, luckily the car has adjustable traction control and ABS so that probably saved me but there was just no grip and my reflexes are very much trained to the 911 characteristics. After a while I got the hang of it and especially after changing the rake (lowered it at the back) and some new tires the car felt very nimble and I also found grip/traction so I dared to go out on to the Nordschleife. As it was the test day before the last race I almost had the track to myself. This helped my confidence a lot though through the very fast section like Schwedenkreuz, Mutkurve I took it easy. Interestingly the race car does not have that loud intake noise like the road car and as the engine is so much closer to you than in the 911 it sounds much more mechanical in the Cayman. In the end I even could stay in the slipstream of an AMG GT3 on the Döttinger Höhe straight, hitting 266km/h in the wet but did not dare then to take Antoniusbuche flat out, lifted and got through it at 240 which felt plenty fast enough on a wet track.
I like the car and would need again more seat time to get used to the mid engine driving dynamics. In 2016 in Spa I got really the hang out of it and loved it. I personally think I still prefer the rear engined driving dynamics on track but as a road car, the Cayman GT4RS is surely great as I love to drive my friends first gen Cayman GT4 very much on the road. But it's horses for courses, you cannot go wrong with either car.
there is no question that the GT4 RS is an (thee?) outstanding version currently in the 718 line up - once it's production cycle is complete it will be as revered and sought after as the 911 GT3 RS 4.0 997.x - it's a seminal product and will be legendary in the annals of Porsche history and Porsche collectors - if you want the best most hard core track version of a street legal 718 - the RS is no doubt, no question, the answer and it is extremely capable and has impressive limits that few drivers (including myself) will ever optimize or reach. As with most Porsche's their car is way more capable than most people in the driver's seat and it takes extreme skill to find the limits of this vehicle.
The GT4 RS is the best no holds barred street legal version of the current generation of 718's - if you want a track version of the 718 that is also street legal you will NOT be disappointed with this purchase.
for me personally I prefer the dynamics of the 911 vs. 718 and the new GT3 is a very hard act to follow (most people opinion not just mine) - but the GT4-RS comes close in my opinion and mets/exceeds the bar in other's opinion - both vehicles are so so so so good in their respective classes that it's the common question parents receive as to who's your favorite child? It's just not possible to answer that.
I stand by my personal preference for the 992 GT3 (maybe even the 991) vs. the GT4 RS - but that by no means means the GT4 RS bad - it is in fact awesome and the most extreme version of itself - if you like the 718 the GT4 RS is more of that same, and it's a glorious version of that same that will not disappoint - and very very capable.
Last edited by daveo4porsche; 12-09-2022 at 12:33 PM.
The GT4 RS is the best no holes barred street legal version of the current generation of 718's
Lol, I'm sorry, I need to correct the use of this expression. It's supposed to be "no holds barred", which is a wrestling term. While your version works... I think it's from a different industry.
Lol, I'm sorry, I need to correct the use of this expression. It's supposed to be "no holds barred", which is a wrestling term. While your version works... I think it's from a different industry.
I've been using this term incorrectly my entire life I never KNEW!
I've fixed my original posting and I appreciate the correction - I'm embarassed and you learn something new every day!
12-07-2022, 12:28 PM
992 GT3 vs GT4 RS
