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I came from TTS (991) to GT3- loved the TTS, and thinking of buying it back. Solid, slippy, fast as lightning. GT3 is a precision weapon, accelerates with flair and makes you feel more connected. I would have both if I could.
I found myself doing that with close colleague...
Him: "what car did you end up buying?"
Me: 3 minutes of discourse about why I went PDK and wing and how economically insane that was b/c i could have spec'd a MT touring...but after having the GTS MT at the track....and dual clutch transmission....really hoping to get a SC or Targa with MT
Him: <blank stare>.
Me; "ummm...a 911"
Him: "oh cool a Porsche, nice car. I ended up with an AMG Mercedes"
100% true story
Staying on topic -- with 350 miles on my GT3 it makes me realize what an absolutely great car the GTS is. I drove a GTS and GT3 back to back a bunch last year. For me on the street I'll take a GTS. Its way faster than it needs to be on public roads, just a touch more compliant, way quieter from a road noise perspective, and a littel more under the radar (I have a wing). I loved that car and trading out for a GT3T on the way to the track last summer got thinking 'what's the hype on the GT3' my GTS is really close.
Fast forward to my first session in the GT3 and I was texting my dealer (sounds like drugs) dangling my GTS for a GT3 allocation.
If I could park my GT3 at my track and park a GTS MT at my house it would be the perfect combo for me.
We all have the same cars! I have a 991.2 targa GTS my absolute favorite. it’s no GT3T but it does the job really well and still gives me that fun factor just running errands (as well as a little sunshine)
I was able to keep my M2CS for some throwback driving which is so much fun. I’ve always wanted to add a Ferrari but I wanted cars I could just hop in and change up day to day in the stable.
LOL True. My daily driver is an M4. I could just sell it and keep the 911s but they both just seem too nice to drive a mile and a half to work to work on a cold engine and just sit in the sun and dust all day every day. I hate to have to park a car in the driveway forever. Curious what others do for garage space. I Could kick my wife's car out to the driveway but not sure I want to face that wrath. Definitely first world problems.
Have a GT3RS and a TTS. I have been buying sports cars for a lot of years. TTS is the quickest sell decision of any car. Too much money for what it does which a base carrera can feel pretty much the same in public roads 95% of the driving. Sound, looks, feel, steering very non-special. These GT cars spoil you so much other non-GT cars dont compare. I think the only exception is a 991.1 GTS i drove that has N/A engine. That felt much nicer to me. I think my problem is turbo charged engine.
Have a GT3RS and a TTS. I have been buying sports cars for a lot of years. TTS is the quickest sell decision of any car. Too much money for what it does which a base carrera can feel pretty much the same in public roads 95% of the driving. Sound, looks, feel, steering very non-special. These GT cars spoil you so much other non-GT cars dont compare. I think the only exception is a 991.1 GTS i drove that has N/A engine. That felt much nicer to me. I think my problem is turbo charged engine.
You're really on an anti-992 TTS crusade. You're right that it has to be driven quite fast to be fun on the road, but when you do that (safely), the car is amazing and a lot of fun. Quite playful when you push it, and it sounds good.
For the road, I think the 991 cars in general are special, and a good choice for people who want less size and refinement than the 992 cars.
You're really on an anti-992 TTS crusade. You're right that it has to be driven quite fast to be fun on the road, but when you do that (safely), the car is amazing and a lot of fun. Quite playful when you push it, and it sounds good.
For the road, I think the 991 cars in general are special, and a good choice for people who want less size and refinement than the 992 cars.
Not really, no crusade. I am being objective here. I never drove the 991 TTS so perhaps this 992 TTS is so much more like a GT car vs the old one. But driving the 992 TTS and 991 GT3/RS back to back, there are more differences than similarities (and part of this dislike on my part is due to the 992 interior dimensions/body style). I'm trying to help others not make expensive mistakes like I have made here but wasn't trying to hurt anyone's feelings.
If you want a sports car that you want to drive all the time, during the day, to get to work, errands, kids school, etc this TTS makes a lot of sense. I would absolutely not suggest GT3 Touring is a daily driver for that purpose. With those parameters defined, this is a car that I see value in (although I'd argue strongly to look at a C4S because of how similar the cars feel/sound/etc due to every 911 being turbocharged now). But if you are like me and you drive your sports cars purely for fun, you want your drives to be always eventful and have pure motorsport joy, there are better options than TTS. Lack of engine noise (and the type of the noise it makes), weight of the car, size (again this is common in 992s), don't make it feel as special as a 991 GT3 does. I'll again mention 991.1 GTS here. You dont need a 991 GT3, I'll actually take a 991.1 GTS over this TTS any day.
It's all about preference and what you are trying to do. TTS has this indestructible tank feel to it that it feels like it can outrun any car, can be driven in any environment, can do many things feel. While that is a huge positive, it makes it less special. This is not an issue for some, it is an issue for others.
Not really, no crusade. I am being objective here. I never drove the 991 TTS so perhaps this 992 TTS is so much more like a GT car vs the old one. But driving the 992 TTS and 991 GT3/RS back to back, there are more differences than similarities (and part of this dislike on my part is due to the 992 interior dimensions/body style). I'm trying to help others not make expensive mistakes like I have made here but wasn't trying to hurt anyone's feelings.
If you want a sports car that you want to drive all the time, during the day, to get to work, errands, kids school, etc this TTS makes a lot of sense. I would absolutely not suggest GT3 Touring is a daily driver for that purpose. With those parameters defined, this is a car that I see value in (although I'd argue strongly to look at a C4S because of how similar the cars feel/sound/etc due to every 911 being turbocharged now). But if you are like me and you drive your sports cars purely for fun, you want your drives to be always eventful and have pure motorsport joy, there are better options than TTS. Lack of engine noise (and the type of the noise it makes), weight of the car, size (again this is common in 992s), don't make it feel as special as a 991 GT3 does. I'll again mention 991.1 GTS here. You dont need a 991 GT3, I'll actually take a 991.1 GTS over this TTS any day.
It's all about preference and what you are trying to do. TTS has this indestructible tank feel to it that it feels like it can outrun any car, can be driven in any environment, can do many things feel. While that is a huge positive, it makes it less special. This is not an issue for some, it is an issue for others.
Again, I wasn't trying to upset anyone here
You first say you're being objective, but then your analysis is mostly subjective. I do think it's mostly subjective, and also depends on the roads we have available to drive on. 992 TTS is capable of being an extreme car, and I do think it's most fun when taken near its extremes - mind-blowing actually, it seems to warp space and time and very agile in corners. Personally, I wouldn't buy one for road-only use, and I bought mine for the track. But I would say the same about all of the 911 GT cars as well, especially 991 and 992 variants. Here's my summary review of the five 911s I currently own:
997.1 C2S manual - most fun and engaging at legal or nearly legal speeds, good punchy torque curve at mid revs, shorter wheelbase and narrower width (compared to 991 and 992) is very apparent
991.1 GT3 - great track car which is still exciting after about a hundred track days in the car, not much fun on the road because it's too loud and not enough torque, really feels like it wants to be wound up near the limit on the track
991.2 C4S cab PDK - best overall road car, all-season, a joy with the top down, fun at all speeds, playful at spirited speeds, quite fast when you want it to be, somehow feels almost old school
991.2 TTS - best and funnest road car when you want to go pretty fast, comfortable when you go legal speeds, and 'everday supercar' just like everyone says it is; feels like another level of performance over the GT3
992 TTS - more like a GT car than the 991.2 TTS and has firmer suspension, reasonably comfortable at sane speeds, only really fun on the road when you're going quite fast; I predict it will be a great track car, and will definitely be a lot faster than the GT3
If a friend asked me which 911 to buy for road-only use as a fun car at sane speeds, I'd say 991.1 or 991.2 cab in C2S, C4S, GTS, or 4 GTS form. Targa looks really cool, but wind buffeting above 65 mph is a problem.
Have a GT3RS and a TTS. I have been buying sports cars for a lot of years. TTS is the quickest sell decision of any car. Too much money for what it does which a base carrera can feel pretty much the same in public roads 95% of the driving. Sound, looks, feel, steering very non-special. These GT cars spoil you so much other non-GT cars dont compare. I think the only exception is a 991.1 GTS i drove that has N/A engine. That felt much nicer to me. I think my problem is turbo charged engine.
LOL... TTS is the quickest sell decision for you perhaps. Different strokes for different folks. The TTS is a freak of nature. So much power with so much poise and with sports exhaust snap/crackle/pop anytime you pull back off the gas in medium or high rev, it has changed my opinion of the car completely. I don't track my cars nor wish to. The TTS is so fast/quick you have to give it props. When I accelerate hard out of a turn I look in the rearview, and there are two black lines that are faint. That car maximizes its acceleration on dry or wet roads. I've never driven anything so fast that is stock. Launch control the TTS and you feel you're at an amusement park getting slingshot out of some nightmare ride.
I bought it as a daily but the color and the tail make it to fancy to drive tot he office. Thus the GT3 T is on order. The TTS stance needed a little bump down and wheels needed to be changed IMO. Part of me wishes it didn't have a tail but the sport design tail variant was my fav. Added H&R springs I can hardly feel it any stiffer yet the stance was bumped down perfect. I have it right where I want it now. It is a daily driver and VERY compliant. Turbos make it a completely different animal than a naturally aspirated car but the excitement of the horsepower is something I thought I would never experience in a non EV car. If you like acceleration and handling with compliance around town the TTS is it. https://flic.kr/s/aHBqjAv5GC
You first say you're being objective, but then your analysis is mostly subjective. I do think it's mostly subjective, and also depends on the roads we have available to drive on. 992 TTS is capable of being an extreme car, and I do think it's most fun when taken near its extremes - mind-blowing actually, it seems to warp space and time and very agile in corners. Personally, I wouldn't buy one for road-only use, and I bought mine for the track. But I would say the same about all of the 911 GT cars as well, especially 991 and 992 variants. Here's my summary review of the five 911s I currently own:
997.1 C2S manual - most fun and engaging at legal or nearly legal speeds, good punchy torque curve at mid revs, shorter wheelbase and narrower width (compared to 991 and 992) is very apparent
991.1 GT3 - great track car which is still exciting after about a hundred track days in the car, not much fun on the road because it's too loud and not enough torque, really feels like it wants to be wound up near the limit on the track
991.2 C4S cab PDK - best overall road car, all-season, a joy with the top down, fun at all speeds, playful at spirited speeds, quite fast when you want it to be, somehow feels almost old school
991.2 TTS - best and funnest road car when you want to go pretty fast, comfortable when you go legal speeds, and 'everday supercar' just like everyone says it is; feels like another level of performance over the GT3
992 TTS - more like a GT car than the 991.2 TTS and has firmer suspension, reasonably comfortable at sane speeds, only really fun on the road when you're going quite fast; I predict it will be a great track car, and will definitely be a lot faster than the GT3
If a friend asked me which 911 to buy for road-only use as a fun car at sane speeds, I'd say 991.1 or 991.2 cab in C2S, C4S, GTS, or 4 GTS form. Targa looks really cool, but wind buffeting above 65 mph is a problem.
Five 911s currently in the stable!? What do you do for car storage needs? Glad to see a 997.1 C2S on the list. That was the one that started it for me. So nimble and well built. The way that it wrapped around you....arguably more Porsche-like than any of the 911s since.
i love your comparison between the 991.1 GTS and GT3 Touring. I also do have a 2016 GTS (ClubCoupe, SPASM, manual, 18 way seats) and am waiting to take delivery of a 992 GT3 Touring. Although I have not yet driven my 992 GT3 Touring, I have driven a 991.2 GT3 and 991.2 Speedster and fully agree with your observations.
The 991.2 GT3, especially with side muffler delete, and the 991.2 Speedster both sound amazing at higher RPM's, but the 991.1 GTS naturally aspirated engine is one of the best sounding Porsche water-cooled engines throughout the rev range. I have never warmed up to the sound of the 991.2 and 992 turbocharged engines and that was one of the main reasons for me to order a GT3 Touring (despite ADM).
The GTS is comfortable, even with SPASM in sport mode and current state of our roads in California. I would not mind having a firmer suspension. I did order bucket seats and will have to see if I will regret my desire for a firmer ride. I do have a 997.1 C2S and can't drive it with suspension in sport mode on our local streets.
Please share your impressions once the GT3 Touring is broken in and you fully explore the range of the engine.
Five 911s currently in the stable!? What do you do for car storage needs? Glad to see a 997.1 C2S on the list. That was the one that started it for me. So nimble and well built. The way that it wrapped around you....arguably more Porsche-like than any of the 911s since.
We have a big garage, but it's now overflowing. We seem to have difficulty with selling cars.
Agree on the 997, feels much more like the old air-cooled 911s than any 991 or 992. 997 to 991 was a really big leap in wheelbase, width, and performance.
LOL... TTS is the quickest sell decision for you perhaps. Different strokes for different folks. The TTS is a freak of nature. So much power with so much poise and with sports exhaust snap/crackle/pop anytime you pull back off the gas in medium or high rev, it has changed my opinion of the car completely. I don't track my cars nor wish to. The TTS is so fast/quick you have to give it props. When I accelerate hard out of a turn I look in the rearview, and there are two black lines that are faint. That car maximizes its acceleration on dry or wet roads. I've never driven anything so fast that is stock. Launch control the TTS and you feel you're at an amusement park getting slingshot out of some nightmare ride.
I bought it as a daily but the color and the tail make it to fancy to drive tot he office. Thus the GT3 T is on order. The TTS stance needed a little bump down and wheels needed to be changed IMO. Part of me wishes it didn't have a tail but the sport design tail variant was my fav. Added H&R springs I can hardly feel it any stiffer yet the stance was bumped down perfect. I have it right where I want it now. It is a daily driver and VERY compliant. Turbos make it a completely different animal than a naturally aspirated car but the excitement of the horsepower is something I thought I would never experience in a non EV car. If you like acceleration and handling with compliance around town the TTS is it. https://flic.kr/s/aHBqjAv5GC
I'm with 3rd Pedal on this one. EV's have pretty much taken away the thunder of the TTS. If you want the amusement park ride, get a Tesla or a Lucid. It's only a matter of time before they build them with better brakes.
But what the EV's can never come anywhere close to approaching is the emotion and the feeling of high revving, NA engines. I'm all in on NA for my "fun car". I've got a twin turbo V8 rocket of a daily driver, but when I want that sense of occasion, I want the thing that revs and is rowdy, even if it's not the fastest car of all time.
04-06-2023, 01:54 PM
