PDCC and ride quality
10-11-2019, 10:12 AM
#1
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Thread Starter
PDCC and ride quality
Does/how does PDCC affect ride quality on public roads vs. just PASM Sport?
I’m considering an 2S - PASM Sport Suspension with both RAS and PDCC. My understanding is that PDCC is really only advantageous on a track. This won’t be my daily driver but both a special day commute/errand car as well as potential limited track use so I’d like to retain both comfort and performance and PDCC is technically intriguing.
I’m considering an 2S - PASM Sport Suspension with both RAS and PDCC. My understanding is that PDCC is really only advantageous on a track. This won’t be my daily driver but both a special day commute/errand car as well as potential limited track use so I’d like to retain both comfort and performance and PDCC is technically intriguing.
10-11-2019, 10:30 AM
#2
Rennlist Member
Comparing my 991.2 C2S with PDCC (and all the performance options) against my previous 991.1 C2S with SPASM, there is no difference in ride quality in Normal. In Sport the PDCC seems just a bit stiffer. The biggest difference with PDCC is that there is no body lean, whether in Normal or Sport. I like it.
10-11-2019, 12:13 PM
#3
Does/how does PDCC affect ride quality on public roads vs. just PASM Sport?
I’m considering an 2S - PASM Sport Suspension with both RAS and PDCC. My understanding is that PDCC is really only advantageous on a track. This won’t be my daily driver but both a special day commute/errand car as well as potential limited track use so I’d like to retain both comfort and performance and PDCC is technically intriguing.
I’m considering an 2S - PASM Sport Suspension with both RAS and PDCC. My understanding is that PDCC is really only advantageous on a track. This won’t be my daily driver but both a special day commute/errand car as well as potential limited track use so I’d like to retain both comfort and performance and PDCC is technically intriguing.
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JHesketh (10-11-2019)
10-11-2019, 01:19 PM
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10-11-2019, 02:12 PM
#6
10-11-2019, 08:26 PM
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Save your money and get the DCS controller when it comes out. Yes, I know they are different but the DSC is well worth the similar benefits it provides: https://www.dscsport.com/porsche/
10-12-2019, 04:31 AM
#10
PDCC does help with comfort as stated above. Yet it doesn't make SPASM unnecessary at all. Stiffer springs help with roll, squat, dive and body motion in general. Plus the sport chassis has a lowered cog, different aero and others.
PDCC is not only helping with body roll, it allows for a constant adaption of the roll torque distribution. Thus it's intention and effect are quite different than ordering a sport chassis.
PDCC is not only helping with body roll, it allows for a constant adaption of the roll torque distribution. Thus it's intention and effect are quite different than ordering a sport chassis.
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chance6 (10-12-2019)
10-12-2019, 11:54 AM
#11
Race Car
Does/how does PDCC affect ride quality on public roads vs. just PASM Sport?
I’m considering an 2S - PASM Sport Suspension with both RAS and PDCC. My understanding is that PDCC is really only advantageous on a track. This won’t be my daily driver but both a special day commute/errand car as well as potential limited track use so I’d like to retain both comfort and performance and PDCC is technically intriguing.
I’m considering an 2S - PASM Sport Suspension with both RAS and PDCC. My understanding is that PDCC is really only advantageous on a track. This won’t be my daily driver but both a special day commute/errand car as well as potential limited track use so I’d like to retain both comfort and performance and PDCC is technically intriguing.
Just my 0.02, but I'd spec it.
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TurboS_GG (10-13-2019)
10-12-2019, 03:19 PM
#12
PDCC, one of the most misunderstood options. Probably because there's a lot of overlap in the way springs, shocks and anti-roll bars function. Understand your suspension, understand PDCC.
Anti-roll bars, all they do is transfer the up or down movement on one side to the other. Turning a corner transfers weight to the outside, the car rolls causing the outside suspension to compress. The anti-roll bar transfers this compression to the other side, pushing the inside up, resulting in less body roll. Not perfectly. Some energy is lost into torsion as the bar twists. Some goes into squishing the bushings holding the bar. This is why the thicker the bar and the more securely its fastened the less the body roll. Compare any GT car, the differences are obvious.
Problem being, the bar is stupid. When the wheel goes up the bar has no way of knowing if its a corner or a bump. It dutifully transmits both equally. But in order to move the other side up it has to overcome the spring on the other side. This has the effect of translating the inside wheel spring rate to the outside wheel. Which happens regardless of whether you want it, as you do for cornering, or don't, like when not cornering hard- ie, most of the time.
PDCC places hydraulics at both ends of the anti-roll bar. The hydraulics can move the bar ends up and down. Not stupidly either, but according to what the car is actually doing. Smart. This allows the car to achieve the low body roll of a stiff bar, with the low spring rate suspension compliance of a smaller bar, both at the same time. Most of the time, straight line, PDCC does nothing, and you enjoy the smooth ride of a car with a soft bar.
Understanding how the suspension works it should be clear that PDCC is an obvious ride comfort feature. Without a doubt. But it can also, depending on how its programmed, improve handling performance. Same goes for PASM. ("There's a lot of overlap..." remember?) When Porsche tunes for PDCC they don't just tune for body roll. They tune for everything. Because everything overlaps everything else. That's why PASM Sport isn't just springs, but includes aero as well.
Sorry. TMI. Back to lurking.
Anti-roll bars, all they do is transfer the up or down movement on one side to the other. Turning a corner transfers weight to the outside, the car rolls causing the outside suspension to compress. The anti-roll bar transfers this compression to the other side, pushing the inside up, resulting in less body roll. Not perfectly. Some energy is lost into torsion as the bar twists. Some goes into squishing the bushings holding the bar. This is why the thicker the bar and the more securely its fastened the less the body roll. Compare any GT car, the differences are obvious.
Problem being, the bar is stupid. When the wheel goes up the bar has no way of knowing if its a corner or a bump. It dutifully transmits both equally. But in order to move the other side up it has to overcome the spring on the other side. This has the effect of translating the inside wheel spring rate to the outside wheel. Which happens regardless of whether you want it, as you do for cornering, or don't, like when not cornering hard- ie, most of the time.
PDCC places hydraulics at both ends of the anti-roll bar. The hydraulics can move the bar ends up and down. Not stupidly either, but according to what the car is actually doing. Smart. This allows the car to achieve the low body roll of a stiff bar, with the low spring rate suspension compliance of a smaller bar, both at the same time. Most of the time, straight line, PDCC does nothing, and you enjoy the smooth ride of a car with a soft bar.
Understanding how the suspension works it should be clear that PDCC is an obvious ride comfort feature. Without a doubt. But it can also, depending on how its programmed, improve handling performance. Same goes for PASM. ("There's a lot of overlap..." remember?) When Porsche tunes for PDCC they don't just tune for body roll. They tune for everything. Because everything overlaps everything else. That's why PASM Sport isn't just springs, but includes aero as well.
Sorry. TMI. Back to lurking.
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10-12-2019, 07:31 PM
#13
PDCC, one of the most misunderstood options. Probably because there's a lot of overlap in the way springs, shocks and anti-roll bars function. Understand your suspension, understand PDCC.
Anti-roll bars, all they do is transfer the up or down movement on one side to the other. Turning a corner transfers weight to the outside, the car rolls causing the outside suspension to compress. The anti-roll bar transfers this compression to the other side, pushing the inside up, resulting in less body roll. Not perfectly. Some energy is lost into torsion as the bar twists. Some goes into squishing the bushings holding the bar. This is why the thicker the bar and the more securely its fastened the less the body roll. Compare any GT car, the differences are obvious.
Problem being, the bar is stupid. When the wheel goes up the bar has no way of knowing if its a corner or a bump. It dutifully transmits both equally. But in order to move the other side up it has to overcome the spring on the other side. This has the effect of translating the inside wheel spring rate to the outside wheel. Which happens regardless of whether you want it, as you do for cornering, or don't, like when not cornering hard- ie, most of the time.
PDCC places hydraulics at both ends of the anti-roll bar. The hydraulics can move the bar ends up and down. Not stupidly either, but according to what the car is actually doing. Smart. This allows the car to achieve the low body roll of a stiff bar, with the low spring rate suspension compliance of a smaller bar, both at the same time. Most of the time, straight line, PDCC does nothing, and you enjoy the smooth ride of a car with a soft bar.
Understanding how the suspension works it should be clear that PDCC is an obvious ride comfort feature. Without a doubt. But it can also, depending on how its programmed, improve handling performance. Same goes for PASM. ("There's a lot of overlap..." remember?) When Porsche tunes for PDCC they don't just tune for body roll. They tune for everything. Because everything overlaps everything else. That's why PASM Sport isn't just springs, but includes aero as well.
Sorry. TMI. Back to lurking.
Anti-roll bars, all they do is transfer the up or down movement on one side to the other. Turning a corner transfers weight to the outside, the car rolls causing the outside suspension to compress. The anti-roll bar transfers this compression to the other side, pushing the inside up, resulting in less body roll. Not perfectly. Some energy is lost into torsion as the bar twists. Some goes into squishing the bushings holding the bar. This is why the thicker the bar and the more securely its fastened the less the body roll. Compare any GT car, the differences are obvious.
Problem being, the bar is stupid. When the wheel goes up the bar has no way of knowing if its a corner or a bump. It dutifully transmits both equally. But in order to move the other side up it has to overcome the spring on the other side. This has the effect of translating the inside wheel spring rate to the outside wheel. Which happens regardless of whether you want it, as you do for cornering, or don't, like when not cornering hard- ie, most of the time.
PDCC places hydraulics at both ends of the anti-roll bar. The hydraulics can move the bar ends up and down. Not stupidly either, but according to what the car is actually doing. Smart. This allows the car to achieve the low body roll of a stiff bar, with the low spring rate suspension compliance of a smaller bar, both at the same time. Most of the time, straight line, PDCC does nothing, and you enjoy the smooth ride of a car with a soft bar.
Understanding how the suspension works it should be clear that PDCC is an obvious ride comfort feature. Without a doubt. But it can also, depending on how its programmed, improve handling performance. Same goes for PASM. ("There's a lot of overlap..." remember?) When Porsche tunes for PDCC they don't just tune for body roll. They tune for everything. Because everything overlaps everything else. That's why PASM Sport isn't just springs, but includes aero as well.
Sorry. TMI. Back to lurking.
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electricborn (01-25-2023)
10-13-2019, 10:13 AM
#14
Rennlist Member
I enjoy the benefits of RAS as much as the PDCC and SPASM. Together, they take my 911 to a whole new handling level, compared to my 15 C2S with just SPASM.
10-13-2019, 06:43 PM
#15
It gives magic carpet like ride. It works well to tackle rough country roads. Smooths the ride out.
I think its more of a 'comfort' option. If you don't get it, you'll still be fine.
Downside is expensive maintenance of replacing the fluid reservoir (its also a filter) every 60k miles (probably okay to do at 80k). The system sounds complex, but its really not if you take a look at it mechanically or on diagrams. Its clever. I *think* the 992 is completely electric (no more hydraulics).
I think its more of a 'comfort' option. If you don't get it, you'll still be fine.
Downside is expensive maintenance of replacing the fluid reservoir (its also a filter) every 60k miles (probably okay to do at 80k). The system sounds complex, but its really not if you take a look at it mechanically or on diagrams. Its clever. I *think* the 992 is completely electric (no more hydraulics).