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With RS parts available at the dealer has anybody tried purchasing installing OEM RS shocks/springs?
That would be one way to ensure that all other pieces(RS wheel carriers, RS top hats, etc) work nicely with the shocks at RS height.
RS spring rates seems reasonable: https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...l#post14969747
As great as that sounds, you have to realize your end usage as suspension assemblies/parts have gotten better as tech has progressed. If you want OEM and are trying to win points, sure. But you’re missing out on better stuff from MCS, Bilstein, and KW. There are a few select parts that are really good. The uprights are one of them. With that said, you have to look to the aftermarket for improved front solid tie rod.
then there is ERP and Rennline with assemblies that blow away factory stuff
Pick your poison, but factory OE stuff is sometimes a limitation….
Do you know more about these coilovers? What are their springs ratios? What range of height adjustments do they cover? I am not looking for hacks likes FVD lowering kit for PSS-10 for example https://www.fvd.net/us-en/115900964B...ront-axle.html. I am looking for a facory-ish setup that works at RS height.
I started different thread https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...the-front.html yesterday where I asked a question about the shocks with longer shock rod so it can accommodate RS(or other monoball) top hats.
The main R suspension parts to covet are he parts w/ bushes
front A-arms
rear A arms
KT arm
to be specific
the RS shocks weren't anything special, not even mono-tubes like the after market Bilsteins an d most other performance options
the main thing w/ the shocks other than valve curves and construction details is the length , both OA and of the rod which connects to the shock top mount, these need to be such as to match, both in parts and setup
Aftermarket shocks and mounts offer as good or better options than RS
many choose to replace bushes rather than the whole arms, sport rubber for mostly street use or mono ball for hard core street or track
also RS never used any thing special for the rear toe arms, sport rubber or monball is wanted here too.
lastly the eccentrics used to make suspension adjustments in back are unreliable for track use, you really want locks and turnbuckles
I've got all other RS parts(bushings, carriers, sway bars, etc) on the car already. Got PSS10 for shocks, but can't make them work with RS monoballs at RS height(Mode/Tarrett hats didn't work neither) - can't get it below RS+10(https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...l#post17415431) as the PSS10 collars get out of the adjustment range. To get to RS height I had to go back to OEM rubber hats.
the main thing w/ the shocks other than valve curves and construction details is the length , both OA and of the rod which connects to the shock top mount, these need to be such as to match, both in parts and setup
That's the thing - what are the shocks(H&R? Bilstein?) that _do_ match RS setup, do you know?
I can't get an answer to this question, hence am considering getting OEM RS shocks that are guaranteed to work. So was wondering if anyone else has done the same.
You have got H&R suspension and you are running at RS height(or even lower) with monoballs, right? You mentioned you had it revalved, but otherwise is it off-the-shelf coilover package?
I've got all other RS parts(bushings, carriers, sway bars, etc) on the car already. Got PSS10 for shocks, but can't make them work with RS monoballs at RS height(Mode/Tarrett hats didn't work neither) - can't get it below RS+10(https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...l#post17415431) as the PSS10 collars get out of the adjustment range. To get to RS height I had to go back to OEM rubber hats.
That's the thing - what are the shocks(H&R? Bilstein?) that _do_ match RS setup, do you know?
I can't get an answer to this question, hence am considering getting OEM RS shocks that are guaranteed to work. So was wondering if anyone else has done the same.
You have got H&R suspension and you are running at RS height(or even lower) with monoballs, right? You mentioned you had it revalved, but otherwise is it off-the-shelf coilover package?
I use Mode front shock mounts(an RS clone) and the Bilstein Cup shocks , these shocks are all shorter than the usual PSS, B6 fare, B8s are the shorter version of the b6 and should also work,
I use Mode front shock mounts(an RS clone) and the Bilstein Cup shocks
What are the Bilstein Cup? I can't find them for sale on the web.
From the pictures you posted before
it looked like they have H&R Sport suspension product number. So are they these https://www.achtuning.com/h-r-29954-...993-c2-and-c4/ for example?
, these shocks are all shorter than the usual PSS, B6 fare, B8s are the shorter version of the b6 and should also work,
Oh, this is super useful. Now this picture from Gert's carnewal.com makes more sense:
What are the Bilstein Cup? I can't find them for sale on the web.
From the pictures you posted before
it looked like they have H&R Sport suspension product number. So are they these https://www.achtuning.com/h-r-29954-...993-c2-and-c4/ for example?
Oh, this is super useful. Now this picture from Gert's carnewal.com makes more sense:
thank you for the reply Bill!
H&R rebrands Bilsteins, the Cup shocks are probably not available any more, I bought the H&R labeled version because I was going to have them revalved anyway,
For street on a lowered car Bilstein B8s are the closest now available, but i'd want them revalved too. The best off the shelf for track use is MCS or JRZ, both are overkill for street use
H&R rebrands Bilsteins, the Cup shocks are probably not available any more, I bought the H&R labeled version because I was going to have them revalved anyway,
H&R that you bought and revalved, weren't they what is called "H&R Sport suspension" now?
If so, I assume I can do the same digressive revalving.
If I understand correctly you also replaced springs with Eibach 600/750. I imagine original springs were softer.
I can do that too - my main concern is the height of "H&R Sport Suspension" stack, whether it can work at RS height(with monoballs like you have) or not.
For street on a lowered car Bilstein B8s are the closest now available, but i'd want them revalved too.
The reason to [digressive] revalve B8s is so you can use harder springs(Eibach 600/750), is that right?
The best off the shelf for track use is MCS or JRZ, both are overkill for street use
Yeah, I don't want to build the car for track use. It has to be primarily for the street/"canyon roads".
H&R that you bought and revalved, weren't they what is called "H&R Sport suspension" now?
If so, I assume I can do the same digressive revalving.
If I understand correctly you also replaced springs with Eibach 600/750. I imagine original springs were softer.
I can do that too - my main concern is the height of "H&R Sport Suspension" stack, whether it can work at RS height(with monoballs like you have) or not.
The reason to [digressive] revalve B8s is so you can use harder springs(Eibach 600/750), is that right?
Yeah, I don't want to build the car for track use. It has to be primarily for the street/"canyon roads".
Possibly, it was a long time ago when I looked into this area
the Cup shocks have a 36mm monotube design front and 46mm rear and are short like the B8, only mono tube shocks can be rebuilt or revalved
Cup part #s are
front: K4-VE3-05816TL K4-VE3-05816TR
rear : F4-BE5-2353-T0
there is also a remote canister version
front: K4-VR3-05927TL K4-VR3-05927TR
rear: F4-BE5-2353-T1
Digressive revalve does make the ride better but it;'s more about control under hard use while still allowing that better ride under less stressful conditions
B8s
front: 35-195276 35-195283
rear: 24-195294
RoW M030 for 993 had the following spring rates
166/286
RS
246/457
Ah, pretty cool. Thank you. Too bad they don't have rear shock absorber available.
Also would be nice if they had some Porsche part numbers to confirm what they are selling.
Do you know what is the difference between 95 and 96 cup shocks options?
I ended up buying used H&R Street Performance shock/springs. Sent them for the rebuild, digressive revalve and new springs(250/450) to Performance Shocks in Sonoma. The rears were quickly diagnosed with bent shafts.
Was advised they can replace the shafts and rebuild them for a little less than what a revalve of a potentially new set would cost, but availability of new set was questionable - lead time was at least several months.
So I went ahead with rebuild. It didn't go as expected.
First, it took several weeks longer than promised. Second, one of the rebuilt shafts had the inner hex too shallow, which resulted in a roundtrip of one shock.
Then after installing the shocks I realized the car was way too high - springs were incorrect length.
PSI agreed to replace springs for shorter ones - I just had to sent the old springs back(good thing I was dyi'ng the work, so didn't have to pay anybody to install/uninstall).
As I was disassembling one of the shocks with newly manufactured shaft, the nut got stuck frozen as I was unwinding it(close to the end of the shaft). I had similar struggle with the other shaft-replaced shock nut, but I managed to unwind it.
To convince PSI it was manufacturing defect I had to sent both shocks back. It took some effort but PSI agreed it was some issue on their end, so I only ended up paying new price for the springs.
The end result was fine though. I ended up with 200mm H&R 80nm/40nm main springs, 55mm Eibach 20nm tenders, which resulted in basically RS ride height and the ride I quite enjoy.
First set of 300mm H&R springs that resulted in super high ride. On 300mm springs 200mm+55mm rears On 200+55 shocks getting diy alignment
I'm also happy to know now what to do if the inner hex on those Bilstein/H&R shock shafts gets destroyed(as they usually do) - you can always replace the shafts(for seemingly reasonable sum of several hundred $). And perhaps rebuild them too.
07-19-2021, 09:15 PM
RS shocks/springs
