Berkley

The 1995 993 C2 that is being advertised to the public as a Ruf BTR Turbo can be found on Autotrader......It is being offered by Rosner Toyota in Fredericksburg VA for $51,995.00 and the contact person is Ed Muhler at 1-888-739-2119.

I spoke with Ed this morning and the car is available; however, he knows little about this Porsche. The dealership's owner is selling the Porsche.

There are enough unanswered questions to prevent me from driving 40 miles to even look at this Porsche in person.

In the" Rennlist Spirit", I am posting this with the hopes of providing help and a "level plaing field".

Best to all

Mark in Baltimore

Autotrader link.

mborkow

here is a link: http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...g=en&cardist=5

Air Kuul TT

Mark,

How far is Fredericksburg, VA from you? Don't get a ticket getting there...

Mark in Baltimore

Tony,

I have no interest in the car. I was a bit curious, though.

Although...I could transfer all of the decals from my car to the RUF and see how well it would do in D class. Hmmmmm...

DJF1

damn, that is a great find and a great price....

simpateko

the $64 question,
is it real?
too good to be true?
is the owner willing to stand behind his claims of authenticity?
jeff

TRINITONY

45 mins from my house.. ...can get there in 30 if in a rush...

tetzlafh

I will probably call RUF Automobile on Monday as long as the VIN is correct to see what was all done if their techs did the job.

Caveman

That looks bloody cheap, especially the mileage? I wish we got deals like that over here! I wonder why they took the RUF steering wheel off?

stedge

I've known about the autotrader ad since yesterday, but how about some opinions here... What is in the spirit of Rennlist? Is it right to move in on another RL'er if one has found the ad, etc, independently? Is it right if the RLer is not going to buy the car, but flip it for a buck, etc? What if that profit is needed?

I think if another broker or dealer is going to get involved, then some other private buyer ought to get it first. Not me - I just doubt it is what it's supposed to be, refuse to get into bidding wars, etc, etc, but I could easily be wrong. Documentation is needed to confirm the value of something like this, and all there is, is a carfax.... If you did 50k worth of mods, wouldn't you have kept a receipt?

I'll get off my little box now. The profiteering pisses me off a bit, that's all. That is not in the spirit of Rennlist. But 2 wrongs don't make a right.

Somebody just buy the damn car.

Rob 97 993c2

I have some info on the car which i will share and seek public opinion on.
I will state that i have no intention of buying it (due to the below as well as an ill parent), so this info is also in the rennlist spirit.


The car was a Ruf BTR conversion but was then overboosted (how stupid!) by the first owner who then was seeking more power. This was done with a boost controller and modification of the ecu. The engine was then blown. As Ruf had then left florida (Ruf North America distributor was then Wassaich in Vancouver), the car went to Prototech in florida for repair. Prototech repaired and rebuilt the entire conversion (and turbo conversion) as they thought it should be done (e.g. prototech has a different view of turbo conversions than Ruf does). The car has a 'dummy' ECU that was not yet fully programmed when it left prototech and was supposed to return to prototech after it was driven a bit. It was then sold to the current owner , but never returned. So, at the very least, the car needs new programming; it has been living w/o a properly tuned ecu. As turbo owners know, proper ecu tuning for turbo mods is never easy to work as a full package.

Any buyer should be concerned by:
1- the Ruf conversion was blownup and then altered by prototech .. i doubt a serious Ruf buyer would pay the ruf premium. Perhaps this is why pics of the engine bay where not disclosed
2- the Ruf BTR is not meant for any additional hp so it is incredibly stupid to try to add more power. Ruf gets value b/c its driveable and very conservative (a BTR is 0.7 bar boost)
3- at best this car is worth what a prototech stage 1 converted c2 is worth minus the cost of proper ECU programming and tuning.
4- most people dont really go ohh-ahh-oohh-aahh over prototech conversions .. they are not the same as Todd at Protomotive who people greatly respect.
5- Ruf in Dallas will neither warranty or repair this car due to the overboosting and modification by prototech. Ruf no longer does BTR c2 conversions (they do Turbo R 993 conversions), so i think i would be hard to get this back to be a proper ruf.
6- i doubt the current owner who does recognize who Ruf is, as well as being in the car business, is so ignorant as to not know how to unload the car. Clearly the wholesale/auction market is higher than 50k for a Ruf BTR. I will go as far as to suggest the current owner is doing all he can to dress the car up with Ruf decals/markings but masking the fact the BTR conversion is no longer 'pure'

if you guys have additional questions, im happy to provide any other info i found out in my research.

So, what do you guys now think this car is worth???????
i hope ive saved somebody the cost of a ppi or perhaps more. If so, you are free to buy me a beer

Lastly, i think its not in the rennlist spirit to auction off information about a car. If you think its undervalued, then buy it with your own capital and resell it (its bad form to expect free $$ w/o committing capital). Otherwise, you should provide information for the rennlist community. Just my opinion.

mborkow

car is on autotrader. anyone can buy it. i'd say the person who found it has the right of first refusal, but that's it; they do not have the right to sell info that is on autotrader (although if someone is silly enough to purchase a link from autotrader then more power to the seller). all of that is just my $.02.

stedge

Fitst - good info on the car, and it ain't worth much. Thanks, Rob.

MBorkow - yeah, my questions were more rhetorical - what is the spirit of Rennlist? Were this a real Ruf and a steal...?

Moot point, anyway. I hope noone gets screwed.

mborkow

i think i understood the spirit of your question, and what i meant to express was that the person who found it had a right to purchase it first (since they brought it to our attention), but if that person decided to pass on the car, then i think the right thing to do was to pass on the info to us free of charge. in my opinion that is just what berkeley did: the person who found the car and showed it to the list wasn't going to purchase it, but wasn't going to offer up the info either...berkeley was just putting it out there for the rest of us now that the finder was passing on making the purchase.