Help with Suspension Choices on 993
10-19-2007, 07:59 PM
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Help with Suspension Choices on 993
"H&R Street Performance Coil Overs" or "Bilstein PSS9 Suspension".
Automotion has a great 20% off offer on orders over $400.
That means this: http://www.automotion.com/productpag...&vehicle=26346 can be had for $1839 or the H&R set up, this: http://www.automotion.com/productpag...&vehicle=26346 for around $1404.
I would greatly appreciate any feedback that you all can give. Car is used for 1 track day a year and is driven moderately hard on the street the rest of time.
Automotion has a great 20% off offer on orders over $400.
That means this: http://www.automotion.com/productpag...&vehicle=26346 can be had for $1839 or the H&R set up, this: http://www.automotion.com/productpag...&vehicle=26346 for around $1404.
I would greatly appreciate any feedback that you all can give. Car is used for 1 track day a year and is driven moderately hard on the street the rest of time.
10-19-2007, 08:10 PM
#4
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Hey,
The PSS-9's are not the same thing as the HD's. The latter cannot be adjsuted but are fine for occasional track use. The former is adjustable (can't recall if it's for rebound or compression or both) but is overkill for a 99.9% street car. The PSS-9's can be a bit more unreliable, too, than the tried-and-true HD's.
The PSS-9's are not the same thing as the HD's. The latter cannot be adjsuted but are fine for occasional track use. The former is adjustable (can't recall if it's for rebound or compression or both) but is overkill for a 99.9% street car. The PSS-9's can be a bit more unreliable, too, than the tried-and-true HD's.
10-19-2007, 09:54 PM
#5
Rennlist Member
Hey,
The PSS-9's are not the same thing as the HD's. The latter cannot be adjsuted but are fine for occasional track use. The former is adjustable (can't recall if it's for rebound or compression or both) but is overkill for a 99.9% street car. The PSS-9's can be a bit more unreliable, too, than the tried-and-true HD's.
The PSS-9's are not the same thing as the HD's. The latter cannot be adjsuted but are fine for occasional track use. The former is adjustable (can't recall if it's for rebound or compression or both) but is overkill for a 99.9% street car. The PSS-9's can be a bit more unreliable, too, than the tried-and-true HD's.
10-20-2007, 01:50 AM
#7
Rennlist Member
Where to get the gear...
I always buy from Rennlist sponsors, if at all possible. If you decide on PSS9s, then check with:
Steve Weiner at Rennsport in Portland, OR as well as Viper Bob (Bob Brooks). You can find Rennsport on the web. You'll need to call Bob on his cell. PM me and I give you his cell. They can also fix you up with the Bilstein HD shocks/struts.
I am certain that Steve and or Bob can provide the extra locking collars as well.
The drop links I like are available from Tarett Engineering. They are so well constructed, you may want to wear them as manly jewelry. I bought a set and they are are on the car now. Ira from Tarett is very helpful and he is a Porsche racer too. http://www.tarett.com/
Steve and Bob can advise you on sway bars. I would stay away from any sway bar that lacks welded collars to prevent the bar from moving side to side under side loads. Sway bars secured with screwed collars, for the average guy, are just another maintenance item. You need to check the allen screws from time to time. Mine got loose, the bar moved to the left resulting in a mis alignment of the drop links to something less than vertical...the drop link and the mounting bracket were broken as a result.
However, let me advise you that if you want a suspension that fits, doesn't break, needs no adjustment or monitoring and is designed by Porsche for the 993..I would do the M030 (RoW) package (Springs, shocks, struts and sway bars). I used this package on the street and the track...I added the 21mm 993 TT rear sway bar for added stiffness to dial out any possible under steer. What troubles did I have? 0, none, nada!!! The package will include drop links. I would recommend the Tarett drop links, but note, these are heim joint, not rubber seated. They will transmit noise to the cabin...you may not want that. For a 99% street car, I'd go with the drop links in the M030 (RoW) package. Note this package will make the car ride a little stiff...but solid.
Some people may scoff at my M030 (RoW) recommendation...but I know first hand that it works, and works well. For me, my M030 (RoW) 80% track, 20% street. I only changed to the PSS9 set up when I got a "used" package that included front and rear ERP monoballs, for cheap. And being cheap, I didn't want to spend 2X money for the 993RS sway bars, I "saved" money by going to after market bars.... about $300, what a dummy
Viper Bob and or Steve Weiner may be able to help you secure the M030 (RoW) package. If they can't PM me and I'll give you a source.
In conclusion, I have had loads of grief with my current suspension...after I switched out the M030 (RoW) for PSS9s, after market sway bars, 993RS drop links rear and stock drop links up front. Gouged rear lower control arm and bent kinematic toe control arm, had to rebuild the PSS9 front struts, 4 broken 993RS rear drop links, one (1) sway bar mount destroyed..make that two.
I would be thousands of dollars ahead had I only stuck with the M030 (RoW) suspension...silly me. Like I said, you may get cons from fellow Rennlisters on my recommendation...but that is to be expected...after all, this is a public BBS.
Steve Weiner at Rennsport in Portland, OR as well as Viper Bob (Bob Brooks). You can find Rennsport on the web. You'll need to call Bob on his cell. PM me and I give you his cell. They can also fix you up with the Bilstein HD shocks/struts.
I am certain that Steve and or Bob can provide the extra locking collars as well.
The drop links I like are available from Tarett Engineering. They are so well constructed, you may want to wear them as manly jewelry. I bought a set and they are are on the car now. Ira from Tarett is very helpful and he is a Porsche racer too. http://www.tarett.com/
Steve and Bob can advise you on sway bars. I would stay away from any sway bar that lacks welded collars to prevent the bar from moving side to side under side loads. Sway bars secured with screwed collars, for the average guy, are just another maintenance item. You need to check the allen screws from time to time. Mine got loose, the bar moved to the left resulting in a mis alignment of the drop links to something less than vertical...the drop link and the mounting bracket were broken as a result.
However, let me advise you that if you want a suspension that fits, doesn't break, needs no adjustment or monitoring and is designed by Porsche for the 993..I would do the M030 (RoW) package (Springs, shocks, struts and sway bars). I used this package on the street and the track...I added the 21mm 993 TT rear sway bar for added stiffness to dial out any possible under steer. What troubles did I have? 0, none, nada!!! The package will include drop links. I would recommend the Tarett drop links, but note, these are heim joint, not rubber seated. They will transmit noise to the cabin...you may not want that. For a 99% street car, I'd go with the drop links in the M030 (RoW) package. Note this package will make the car ride a little stiff...but solid.
Some people may scoff at my M030 (RoW) recommendation...but I know first hand that it works, and works well. For me, my M030 (RoW) 80% track, 20% street. I only changed to the PSS9 set up when I got a "used" package that included front and rear ERP monoballs, for cheap. And being cheap, I didn't want to spend 2X money for the 993RS sway bars, I "saved" money by going to after market bars.... about $300, what a dummy
Viper Bob and or Steve Weiner may be able to help you secure the M030 (RoW) package. If they can't PM me and I'll give you a source.
In conclusion, I have had loads of grief with my current suspension...after I switched out the M030 (RoW) for PSS9s, after market sway bars, 993RS drop links rear and stock drop links up front. Gouged rear lower control arm and bent kinematic toe control arm, had to rebuild the PSS9 front struts, 4 broken 993RS rear drop links, one (1) sway bar mount destroyed..make that two.
I would be thousands of dollars ahead had I only stuck with the M030 (RoW) suspension...silly me. Like I said, you may get cons from fellow Rennlisters on my recommendation...but that is to be expected...after all, this is a public BBS.
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10-20-2007, 09:09 AM
#9
Bilstein Setup
Martin hit the nail on the head. I just spent $2k on a Bilstein HD setup and after driving 300 miles, am already facing a broken rear sway bar drop link. If I would have purchased factory parts designed for the 993, would not be facing having the shocks reinstalled with additional locking collars, a new drop link and then the cost of realignment. Hindsight is 20 20 but guys experience who have been there done that and already experienced the problems, that is invaluable. So is this forum.
10-20-2007, 09:14 AM
#10
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Is Martin suggesting that by installing just the coilovers (either the PSS9's or JIC's) and no other parts, that all kind of other parts are going to break?
The price at Automotion is hard to resist for the PSS9's but .........
The price at Automotion is hard to resist for the PSS9's but .........
10-20-2007, 09:50 AM
#11
Rennlist Member
Also, Martin is referring to sway bars with bolt-on collars like the TRG bars that can suffer from loosening collars, although in over three years of use, I have not had any issues with my TRG bars.
10-20-2007, 08:44 PM
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I recently installed the MO33 springs w/Bilsteins extra thread and MO30 sway bars from Gert(Carnewal)
and although it is stiffer tha before, as it should be,it is very controlled and compliant and corners flat,gone is the floatiness of the standard suspension.It is exactly what I was looking for.
Although I never rode on a MO30 car before, I'm very pleased and would strongly recommend this set-up.I'm street use only.height is set at ROW sport,I only wish I hadn't waited so long.Hope this helps.
Joseph
_____________________________
96 C2,midnight blue/blue,MY 02 17" wheels,RSR exhaust,ROW MO33/Bilsteins,MO30 sways,motorsound intake,996 Turbo 3-spoke,carbon/leather shifter and brake handle.
and although it is stiffer tha before, as it should be,it is very controlled and compliant and corners flat,gone is the floatiness of the standard suspension.It is exactly what I was looking for.
Although I never rode on a MO30 car before, I'm very pleased and would strongly recommend this set-up.I'm street use only.height is set at ROW sport,I only wish I hadn't waited so long.Hope this helps.
Joseph
_____________________________
96 C2,midnight blue/blue,MY 02 17" wheels,RSR exhaust,ROW MO33/Bilsteins,MO30 sways,motorsound intake,996 Turbo 3-spoke,carbon/leather shifter and brake handle.