our cars vs gt3 rs

Basal Skull · 11-07-2009, 02:55 AM

There was a thread recently about our cars vs a Nissan...
A friend has an allocation for a new gt3 rs. ? do I have any hope of keeping up?

I have Motons, H&R sways, lowered, camber -2 all around, LWFW, UMW Stage 2, 100 cell race cats, extra oil coolers, recaro poles.

Any suggestions? larger wheels/weight loss help? should I try what 2wd feels like? do I need to spend any more money?

Greg H. · 11-07-2009, 03:36 AM

I think at some point it has more to do with the driver than the car. I pass plenty of 6GT3s, 7Gt3 and today, GT3RS. I have been passed by 993 N/A. Go figure.

Greg H.

Basal Skull · 11-07-2009, 04:01 AM

Hi Greg,
I agree about the driver thing but unfortunately, I'm not sure I'm a better driver and having a faster car sure makes things easier!

Ryojo

Jean · 11-07-2009, 05:48 AM

During a 1 lap sprint, I put 6 seconds on the fastest driven 997GT3RS with my car at close to 1400kgs and with street GT2 bodywork (unlike the avatar). I run at 1 Bar.

I had better tires than him and our track is quite fast and 5.4kms. The GT3 driver is a Porsche AG certified instructor and Cup racer and much better driver than I am.

I had 265 front and 315 rear Hoosier R6, Moton Clubsport, -2.5 front camber, -2.3 rear. He sold his car the next day after owning it for 2 weeks and got a GT2.

Spartan · 11-07-2009, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jean

During a 1 lap sprint, I put 6 seconds on the fastest driven 997GT3RS with my car at close to 1400kgs and with street GT2 bodywork (unlike the avatar). I run at 1 Bar.

I had better tires than him and our track is quite fast and 5.4kms. The GT3 driver is a Porsche AG certified instructor and Cup racer and much better driver than I am.

I had 265 front and 315 rear Hoosier R6, Moton Clubsport, -2.5 front camber, -2.3 rear. He sold his car the next day after owning it for 2 weeks and got a GT2.

Nice work Jean! Looking at your camber settings thats not very aggressive, I was always told that R6's needed at least 3.5 deg of camber etc but after Kelly Moss setup my car they used less and the car never handled so well with even tire wear go figure

I've only been had the opportunity to pass a GT3RS once and I passed it but to be fair we aren't comparing apples to apples. A heavily track prepped 993tt with an "ok" driver will make quick work of just about anything

Jean · 11-07-2009, 01:07 PM

Spartan, thanks my lap was a lap record so everything went well that day.

On Dunlop slicks my car was setup at 2.3 deg camber by the same engineer of Bergmeister's 997 Cup S that uses the same tires in FIA GT3. Seems like this is what works best on these tires, Hoosiers worked well at similar setups. BTW the sizes I gave above were for my Sport Cups, I apologize, the R6 I was running were 245/40 Fr and 335/30 rear.

A well prepared (heavily modified) 993TT can give many of the new cars, even prepared, a run for their money, as long as they are short races because the older cars get the driver tired comparatively speaking to the new generations, since you will be driving at the limit to be fast, then when heat soaks in, watercooled cars keep the same pace effortlessly while aircooled tend to loose some performance.

Basal Skull · 11-07-2009, 03:31 PM

Thanx for the responses! Reconfirmed my belief that our cars are a good platform for keeping up with the newer cars. Seems I may need some more hp and loose a little wt ... Looking forward to next year's driving season, lots of rain right now in Vancouver and all I can do is day dream. Thinking about a lithium battery and removing my door panels!

CP · 11-07-2009, 04:08 PM

When I was at Thunderhill, my instructor (Brandon Krause) drove my Ruf BTR to 1.97 minute lap time. That's pretty good even for GT3RSs.

So yeah, given equal drivers, we can hang with them. If you have a BIG track, our HP and especially TQ advantages, would shine even more.

CP

Greg H. · 11-07-2009, 04:44 PM

CP - Was that over the top? That's the fastest time I have heard of by a street 911.

Greg H.

Acropora · 11-08-2009, 01:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jean

He sold his car the next day after owning it for 2 weeks and got a GT2.

Hehe. You must be quite a driver Jean. I've passed quite a few RS's but prolly only because they weren't driven well. I have a heck of a time running w/ a buddy driving his stock z06 on hoosiers. But then I run r888's and he's raced 20+ years.

Spartan · 11-08-2009, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acropora

Hehe. You must be quite a driver Jean. I've passed quite a few RS's but prolly only because they weren't driven well. I have a heck of a time running w/ a buddy driving his stock z06 on hoosiers. But then I run r888's and he's raced 20+ years.

Why on earth are you running R888's at the track?! Thats just wrong

CP · 11-08-2009, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg H.

CP - Was that over the top? That's the fastest time I have heard of by a street 911.

Greg H.

Greg,

Brandon is a semi-pro racer and TH is his home track. Hope that explains things.

CP

JJayB · 11-08-2009, 09:08 PM

You didn't mention what spring rates your running. The RS are still pretty soft and you have the edge on torque. Unless your friend is Walter Rohrl, my odds are 70/30 for you.

Basal Skull · 11-08-2009, 09:36 PM

My spring rates are pretty conservative, it's still +50% street car. Front 200lb tender/457lb main, rear 200lb tender/629lb main. They tighten up nicely when I adjust the moton cs, I have them full soft for the street and about mid position compression all around for the track. I find the amount of roll in the corners acceptable, don't know how things would be if stiffer. I know I don't like the motons turned up too much, especially in the rear or I start to struggle with oversteer.

JJayB · 11-08-2009, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Basal Skull

My spring rates are pretty conservative, it's still +50% street car. Front 200lb tender/457lb main, rear 200lb tender/629lb main. They tighten up nicely when I adjust the moton cs, I have them full soft for the street and about mid position compression all around for the track. I find the amount of roll in the corners acceptable, don't know how things would be if stiffer. I know I don't like the motons turned up too much, especially in the rear or I start to struggle with oversteer.

Slap on some R6 Hoosiers and the odds makers will bump you to 75/25http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:forums.rennlist.com/get/rennforums/images/smilies/beerchug.gif

11-07-2009, 02:55 AM	#1
Basal Skull Addict Rennlist Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Vancouver BC Posts: 625	our cars vs gt3 rs There was a thread recently about our cars vs a Nissan... A friend has an allocation for a new gt3 rs. ? do I have any hope of keeping up? I have Motons, H&R sways, lowered, camber -2 all around, LWFW, UMW Stage 2, 100 cell race cats, extra oil coolers, recaro poles. Any suggestions? larger wheels/weight loss help? should I try what 2wd feels like? do I need to spend any more money? __________________ Basal Skull '97 993tt Arena Red '06 CTT Basalt Black '85 Targa Prussian Blue (gone)

11-07-2009, 04:01 AM	#3
Basal Skull Addict Rennlist Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Vancouver BC Posts: 625	Hi Greg, I agree about the driver thing but unfortunately, I'm not sure I'm a better driver and having a faster car sure makes things easier! Ryojo __________________ Basal Skull '97 993tt Arena Red '06 CTT Basalt Black '85 Targa Prussian Blue (gone)

11-07-2009, 05:48 AM	#4
Jean Addict Lifetime Rennlist Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Dubai- Beirut Posts: 4,442	During a 1 lap sprint, I put 6 seconds on the fastest driven 997GT3RS with my car at close to 1400kgs and with street GT2 bodywork (unlike the avatar). I run at 1 Bar. I had better tires than him and our track is quite fast and 5.4kms. The GT3 driver is a Porsche AG certified instructor and Cup racer and much better driver than I am. I had 265 front and 315 rear Hoosier R6, Moton Clubsport, -2.5 front camber, -2.3 rear. He sold his car the next day after owning it for 2 weeks and got a GT2. __________________ Protomotive 993 3.8TT 2WD. 100-200kph -> 5.2s @1Bar

11-07-2009, 01:07 PM	#6
Jean Addict Lifetime Rennlist Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Dubai- Beirut Posts: 4,442	Spartan, thanks my lap was a lap record so everything went well that day. On Dunlop slicks my car was setup at 2.3 deg camber by the same engineer of Bergmeister's 997 Cup S that uses the same tires in FIA GT3. Seems like this is what works best on these tires, Hoosiers worked well at similar setups. BTW the sizes I gave above were for my Sport Cups, I apologize, the R6 I was running were 245/40 Fr and 335/30 rear. A well prepared (heavily modified) 993TT can give many of the new cars, even prepared, a run for their money, as long as they are short races because the older cars get the driver tired comparatively speaking to the new generations, since you will be driving at the limit to be fast, then when heat soaks in, watercooled cars keep the same pace effortlessly while aircooled tend to loose some performance. __________________ Protomotive 993 3.8TT 2WD. 100-200kph -> 5.2s @1Bar

11-07-2009, 03:31 PM	#7
Basal Skull Addict Rennlist Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Vancouver BC Posts: 625	Thanx for the responses! Reconfirmed my belief that our cars are a good platform for keeping up with the newer cars. Seems I may need some more hp and loose a little wt ... Looking forward to next year's driving season, lots of rain right now in Vancouver and all I can do is day dream. Thinking about a lithium battery and removing my door panels! __________________ Basal Skull '97 993tt Arena Red '06 CTT Basalt Black '85 Targa Prussian Blue (gone)

11-07-2009, 03:36 AM	#2
Greg H. Addict Rennlist Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Orinda, California Posts: 1,420	I think at some point it has more to do with the driver than the car. I pass plenty of 6GT3s, 7Gt3 and today, GT3RS. I have been passed by 993 N/A. Go figure. Greg H.

11-07-2009, 04:08 PM	#8
CP Addict Rennlist Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Los Altos, CA Posts: 4,972	When I was at Thunderhill, my instructor (Brandon Krause) drove my Ruf BTR to 1.97 minute lap time. That's pretty good even for GT3RSs. So yeah, given equal drivers, we can hang with them. If you have a BIG track, our HP and especially TQ advantages, would shine even more. CP __________________ 993 RUF BTR-2 2007 Cayman, Meteor Gray Rennlist membership #031217-4871. Yiiiippeee!!!

11-07-2009, 04:44 PM	#9
Greg H. Addict Rennlist Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Orinda, California Posts: 1,420	CP - Was that over the top? That's the fastest time I have heard of by a street 911. Greg H.

11-08-2009, 09:08 PM	#13
JJayB Addict Rennlist Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Orange Park Acres, CA Posts: 889	You didn't mention what spring rates your running. The RS are still pretty soft and you have the edge on torque. Unless your friend is Walter Rohrl, my odds are 70/30 for you. __________________ Jimmy the fugitive (rehabilitated by traffic school) 993tt ANDIAL 3.8 twin plug 08' CLK 63 Black

11-08-2009, 09:36 PM	#14
Basal Skull Addict Rennlist Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Vancouver BC Posts: 625	My spring rates are pretty conservative, it's still +50% street car. Front 200lb tender/457lb main, rear 200lb tender/629lb main. They tighten up nicely when I adjust the moton cs, I have them full soft for the street and about mid position compression all around for the track. I find the amount of roll in the corners acceptable, don't know how things would be if stiffer. I know I don't like the motons turned up too much, especially in the rear or I start to struggle with oversteer. __________________ Basal Skull '97 993tt Arena Red '06 CTT Basalt Black '85 Targa Prussian Blue (gone)