Sneaky Pete

Macster nailed the cost.....I wish I could do this repair myself. We only have one dealer in the area. Living in Indy there has to be some other options for a shop. The problem I have is this my DD and need it fixed fast. I'm thinking a clutch and AOS are due.

logray

If you are already spending $5000 and add on some other goodies while you are in there, consider another 10 year lease on life... send it to Jake - for somewhere I am guessing around or less than double that, the entire engine aside from inside the case will have a once over - including lots of new components done by the master himself. Maybe you could borrow another car from someone for a while?

Honestly after going through this myself, I am looking at $10k for a full rebuild - granted that will include a lot of better internal parts as well as more displacement (3.6L), balanced crankshaft/etc.

If sending it to flat 6 innovations is not in the cards for your since you need it every day, I would seriously shop around on that price. I think I've read of some shops that get you in and out of half of that on the same job. The dealers seem to charge between 50% to 100% more than independents.

Try JFP in PA over on renntech.org ... he runs a very tight shop. Not that 500 miles is close to indy (assuming the PA in his title indicates his shop is in PA), but hey maybe it would be an option for you.

He is on this forum too, but we don't get to see him much here.

logray

Macster, I am not sure where you are getting this information from, but on his M96-01 engine the three chain/paddle tensioners are all accessible externally without removing the transmission. In fact, the bank 1 and IMS tensioners are dead simple to access with a 32mm socket. The 4-6, bank 2 tensioner is a pain in the *** because you have to remove the air conditioner to gain access to it. The newer style bank 2 tensioner is a little easier because it is a 12mm (IIRC) allen head socket.

The variocam actuators/chain tensioners are accessible behind the camshaft covers, which several crafty individuals have been able to do without removing the engine from car (by removing bumper, heat shield, muffler, and then lowering the engine a little bit). Of course without removing the transmission.

Sneaky Pete

Update....the dealer quote was too rich and I took the car down road to their competition at half the cost. I didn't want to but it is what it is. Now, while the motor is out (this is if they take it out) what else should I look at for preventive measures? The car has 100K miles and all internals are original as far as I know.

Thinking:

1. Clutch......stock or performance / sport clutch
2. IMS...I don't oppose the issue or company just the marketing plan...so let's not turn this thread into a IMS thang!
3. While the cam covers are off is there anything else in there that should looked at? Replaced?

All ears on this.

logray

Stock clutch, and if you need a new dual mass flywheel, or at least have the current flywheel inspected. Lightweighgt flywheel and race clutch = bad unless you have the entire mass balanced and perhaps a harmonic damper crank pulley

AOS and possibly consider oil cooler.

Any seal, oring, and gasket that can be easily reached on the following items (example AOS tubes, aos breather, intake manifold, cam position sensors, throttle body gasket, brake booster to intake gasket)

Spark tubes and orings

Variocam pads

Cam to cam timing chain

Sure IMS if you are up to it.

(below this I start to get silly)

You could do lifters but then you might have to do lifter carrier as well.

HEll, then why not pull the heads and do a valve job.

But then why not crack open the case and get a 3.6 L bore upgrade... Ok sorry for being silly

dsowen

Pete, missed this thread earlier--sorry to hear it turned out to be relatively costly. Hopefully, they won't have to pull the motor. I've got a truck I could loan you, but I'm not sure how to get it from Louisville to Indy. Let me know if I can help.

Sneaky Pete

Wow! Thanks for the offer David but I got a rental to hold me over.

ivangene

Pete.

the tensioners should be very carefully inspected, any "mushrooming" will make them eventually stick, cheap to replace now. Also if they pull the cams (which they will have to to change an actuator) have them look at all the lifters , look for wear marks in the center that are excessive. These have been known to have the valve stem punch right thru the lifter once they get thin) - pads for the chains obviously, they should not have to pull the motor...NO WAY

but if they do we will discuss "that list"

this isnt a big job, dont read more into that it is, its just an actuator then its a simple in and out operation. Seen many of them done.

Cheers, she'll be on the road soon enough

Macster

This came up when my Boxster was in the shop for its VarioCam solenoid/actuator R&R. We were talking about the other chain drives and their respective tensioners/guides and the techs told me that to get at one of the chain guides the transmission has to come out because a bolt necessary to get to (remove/install) for this job is covered by the housing.

I assume this is true of the engine in the 996 models, though of course this is only an assumption.

If I'm wrong then thanks for the correction.

Sincerely,

Macster.

ivangene

no, there is no tensioner in there, on the m96 they are all outside as logray has stated

chsu74

I dropped my engine to do a major overhaul and should get it back in the next few days. Irene messed up my parts delivery schedule.... your list is very similar to mine. I found a shop to drop a motor for $1800 plus cost of parts. It will probably be around $5500 to $6,000 total for me. Aside from the items mentioned above, I also replaced:
Lifters.
Coolant lines since it runs in the tranny tunnel. Tranny is dropped.
RMS
water pump and thermostat assembly
Coolant hoses
CAM plugs
spark plug tubes
Various seals

Sneaky Pete

All good points! The water pump, coolant tank and hoses were replaced a year ago. The rest are in the queue of being replaced. Throw a clutch in there and we are in the same range.

Macster

The tensioners are accessible without having to remove the tranmission but are the guides/rails against which the tensioner applies pressure?

A bad tensioner -- bad enough to require replacement -- could have resulted in accelerated wear/tear of the guide/rail thus I'd be a bit concerned that if the tensioner required replacing that the guide/rail could need replacing too.

Sincerely,

Macster.

ivangene

I'ld have to go back over my thinking but I dont think the long one that goes to the crank can be changed without serious engine dissassembly...the 2/side on the actuator are pretty easy, there is also one for the chain from the crank to IMS shaft... (total of 7 IIRC on the 5 chain motors)

logray

Yep, pretty much have to pull the heads and split the case to get to the paddles...