andys-944

Hi,
So following the untimely demise of my 2000 C4 cab just before Christmas I purchased a 2011 Jaguar XKR coupe with 23,500 miles. A number of people here asked if I would give a update of ownership and comparisons.
The good;
Super charged V8 with 510BHP and 461ftlbs of torque.
Beautiful styling and trim.

The bad;
She's back to the dealer for the 4th time today, for a electronic differential warning light.
Other problems;
Drivers door will not latch (frozen),
Excessive wind noise at 80-90 far worse than a 2000 C4 cab
Torn rubber boots on the lower rear stabilizer bar both sides.
Peeling firewall insulation.
Cracked interior trim,
New cat required to fix obd code
Glove box damper string broken.
New brake pads at 24,000 mile covered under warranty.
Random check engines lights fixed by software update.

Its a beautiful and fast car and when everything is functioning she is composed and handle well even on ice and snow.
Interestingly there's less headroom in the back seats than the 996 cab.

My verdict is out I love the car but the she's just not built like a Porsche.
My heart would like to keep her but I've asked the dealer for a purchase price.
I wish I had enough cash to buy a another C4 for daily use and keep the XKR for special days.

prosled8

So, unfortunately Jaguar hasn't shaken its traditional quality issues. That is a shame because they are beautiful to behold. Re minds me of my old BMW 750iL, 100k car that was at the dealer 25 times in its first 50k miles. Don't even ask why I kept it that long...

I too would consider replacing that car. I suspect the dealer loaners are not as nice as the XKR or C4

porschemikeandnancy

andys 944:

There is a reason the old joke about British electronics has been around since the 50's:

Why do the British drink warm beer?
Because they have Lucas refrigerators.
(Lucas, also called "prince of darkness")

Prince Charles (there is a valid reason why his mom has not abdicated the throne - and will not as long as she's alive). Many years ago, the prince was talking about the decline of the British motor industry. He blamed the British unions and their fierce anti-management stance for the poor quality (this was a world wide understanding - not simply an opinion) of British cars.

I also think that the complexity of 21st century vehicles - with all the sensors and computer controls (dozens of processors in a modern car - all of which are supposed to "talk" to each other) has gotten away from all but the very best technologists. Even the Germans have had problems. Mercedes Benz adopted fiber optics for the internal wiring in the mid-90's and the first half dozen years were horrible with teething problems.

Hope they can straighten out your car - but frankly, I doubt it.

fpb111

Lucas factory motto, "A good days work and home before dark."
After owning an XK120, XK140, Mark IX, and XKE sadly found some truth in that.

andys-944

What sucks is that I'm English, I've worked for TWR / Jaguar sport and even worked with Ian Callum the designer of the XK and I would love to be able to tell how great the car is
The sad part is the its not just electronic issues, if it was just the E diff it wouldn't really matter its the stupid stuff like torn bushings at 25k which talking on the Jag forum isn't unusual wtf i have a 170k jeep with perfect original rubber boots.
I did learn the quickest way to get a post removed from a face book page ! is to post on the Jaguar wall your glad they understand about there cold weather problems with there current ad's showing a frozen environmental chamber

white out

That sucks to hear. My mom's XKR has been flawless over the past 15 years.

andys-944

fbp111, I'm jealous! I've worked on restorations of XK120 and 150's ridden in them but never driven, far less owned beautiful cars.

dwdunn

Sorry to hear of your troubles.
My 2006 6 Series BMW was a beautiful, comfortable car; leather on leather, V8, convertible, 19" wheels, sports and winterization packages but the electronics were the PITS!
The 'Dynamic Drive' code would throw, the car would go into a 'limp home' mode more times than I would like to remember. The dealer never found the problem.
It was a low miles car but I dumped it at a loss as soon as the warranty was up.
Porsche needs to be very wary of adding so much electronic nannies and gadgets in the new cars, they might end up in the same boat. Hopefully not......This is why I like my 996; very few electronic nannies and gadgets but the air conditioning works very well, modern suspension, etc.

Kalashnikov

Thanks for the feedback Andy.

I actually looked at 2009 XKRs, but the possibility of the infamous "Jag" problems kept me away. I loved the interior, the looks, and the exhaust note...but I knew deep down that the moment I start driving the car I will start getting CEL, SRS, "reduced power, please drive to the garage immediately".

I even read some ridiculous posts about the SC motor freezing solid in a cold weather due to condensation from supercharger getting into the combustion chamber and locking the engine. Jag solution was to "let the car thaw and then evacuate the water".

Went out after work to start my '04 XJR, turned the key, and got a kind of click - click - click from the engine. I'm thinking, great, the battery died. Tried to jump it with a co-workers diesel Jetta, and it still goes click-click-click. All the lights and everything else seems to be fine. So I ask another co-worker with a Tahoe (big battery), and does the same thing. Didn't want to work on it in the cold, (high of 8 degrees F, low of -5 that morning), so got a ride home while I could. Asked a friend who had a spare Jag battery and a load tester if I could borrow them for the day. Next day, after a low of -2 F, hooked up the load tester to my existing battery. It was on the edge of green (12v), and when loaded, dropped to 10.5v. I hooked the new battery up, and tried again. Same result - click-click-click. Connected the 2 batteries together, and still no luck.

I called the dealer, and the tech said the starters rarely go out, and it was probably a relay. I swapped the relays around, and it didn't seem to make a difference. I didn't feel like messing with it in the cold anymore. Now the dilemma - I can get it towed 28 miles home or 32 miles to the dealer. Being that I've been having problems with my heat (see thread) I decided to flatbed it to the dealer. Next day, I call in the afternoon, and the Service Rep said they've determined the starter is okay and there's no problem with the relay. They had a similar situation 2 years ago with another XJR, but they want to confirm their suspicions. I get a follow up call about 2 hours later, saying that water has gotten into the spark plug wells, and frozen the engine. There's no water in the engine, nothing in the oil, and the antifreeze is up to spec. They said that water enters near the cowl, drips on to the supercharger throttle body boot, and because of the way the clamp and boot were configured, gets funneled on to the engine. He said that Jaguar designed the engine so that if there are fluids on it, they would flow to these spark plug wells, so that it doesn't get into the engine. The cold temperatures were enough to make the engine freeze.

Their fix is to let the car thaw, then remove the spark plugs so they can evac the water out of the wells, and rotate the thottle body boot so that it doesn't provide a funnel action for future water to get in.

I'm a little skeptical...

BBA

That's a shame. Around 2000 during Ford's ownership they actually got quite good. My 2000 XJR was fantastic. They were also reasonably simple cars back then. More gizmos = more stuff to go wrong, and for some reason the British and the Germans have a hard time making reliable electronics. They need to sub it out to the Japanese......

D6lc

I know how you feel as a Brit here in the US I would love to have another Jag, I think they look great and have beautiful interiors......but!

Just before I left the UK I had a Jaguar XF as a company car on lease, looked great drove great but had a load of issues, rear screen had to be replaced as it is distorted (like looking through bi focal glasses, how it left the factory without anyone noticing is a mystery), rattles, rotary gearbox locked up one night and froze all the electrics whilst doing a U turn - lukily at the end of my road so had to just leave it there in the road until the tow truck dragged it away, electric parking brake seized up after 6 months from new.

I'm not happy when people having a good a british cars but for gods sake they deserve the bad wrap.

Schnell Gelb

Andy,
Like you I have a Porsche and a Jag.Have had for many years. Used to work for Jag. Best advice for both cars- do NOT buy from a Dealer. Spend time on Rennlist/Jag-Lovers to find the best Indie.Buy through them - preferably one of their customer's cars. At least get the PPI done there. A good indie knows all the quirks and solutions- dealer -not so much! Just my biased experience.

andys-944

Thanks guys, It does pain me to knock Jag. I spent some time on the phone today with a guy from Jag customer relations. he didn't get it I'm trying to explain that the E-Diff problem doesn't really bother me all cars can have problems its the little things like the rubber boots which just talk of ****ty quality or attention to detail.

lingpoen

here here mate, to ur honesty and sincerity. it is very hard and I commend u!

Schnell Gelb

When I worked for Jaguar those "Customer Relations" fools drove me and fellow enthusiast-geeks nuts. We techies wanted to hear ALL the problems, first hand - so we could fix them ! The C/R guys were just like the NHS(Obamacare in England!) -all issues get the "triple D" deflect,delay,deny. We few were the opposite ,outnumbered, scorned for being negative problem seekers. Interestingly we were also the 'car guys' - always tinkering with old Jags,lawn mowers- anything mechanical - even fitted Megajolt/Squirt to XKE's. We never logged hours ,just successes - in finding fixes.
The Dealers were a very mixed bunch. There were a few dealer Techs who were brilliant but they often became Indies. I would visit them and give them every possible assistance because they kept out-of-warranty Jag owners happy. They often came up with ingenious fixes that were very helpful and I would circulate the new info among other Indies. This was all in my own private time pursuing the car diy hobby. Many of the Jag components were generic - Ac Delco/Denso/ZF etc - very similar to BMW & Mercedes. So we few zealots would glean info form the 'other side' too and use it to solve problems.
Yes, you guessed it- we were not popular with Senior Management ! They knew little about the cars, cared more about company politics and 'relationships' with dealers - but the wrong dealers -they dumped Penske !Our best dealer by far. That was the end for me ,in more ways than one.
But there is a silver lining - the latest Jags depreciate terribly .If you can understand the failings that are fixable and find a good Jag-Indie -it could be interesting.If you use the dealer ,not so much.Just my experience after joining Jag straight from university.Sad. But remember that silver lining and Jag-Lovers Forum.