Notices
996 GT2/GT3 Forum 1999-2005
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

First track outing

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 01-17-2024, 07:54 PM
  #46  
philrob1
Instructor
 
philrob1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 120
Received 65 Likes on 47 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by powdrhound
It's best to use a collared shock mount brackets arrangement for your front drop link vs. morning it to the wheel carrier which is far from ideal. The high up mounting arrangement minimizes any binding / preload as the wheels turn.

I was going to ask about those Tarrett items but your response here has confirmed I need them - thanks

Maybe it's a different in shock design, but Pwdr, your drop link mounts appear to be between the threaded collars, but the pictures directly above (Ohlins setup) appear to show the collar sitting on the wheel carrier...?

Surely this increases the height that the shock mounts into the carrier?

Last edited by philrob1; 01-17-2024 at 07:55 PM.
Old 01-17-2024, 08:05 PM
  #47  
De Jeeper
Nordschleife Master
 
De Jeeper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Delaware
Posts: 5,576
Received 3,283 Likes on 1,715 Posts
Default

Should not matter where the mount is. U can make up the length in the adjustable sway links. Honestly mine should be like his as my links r pretty much at the minimum length. The tarett brackets r threaded so im using them as the stop along with the collar above. It does not effect height of car if there are in either position. U would just set your height using either as the stop.

I think that answers your question?
Old 01-18-2024, 04:31 AM
  #48  
powdrhound
Rennlist Member
 
powdrhound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 6,844
Received 1,732 Likes on 1,008 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by philrob1
Maybe it's a different in shock design, but Pwdr, your drop link mounts appear to be between the threaded collars, but the pictures directly above (Ohlins setup) appear to show the collar sitting on the wheel carrier...?

Surely this increases the height that the shock mounts into the carrier?
I use the lower collar on the shock as the "stop" for the shock body. The sway bar bracket simply threads down just above that. I could have omitted that lower collar and simply used the sway bar bracket as the "stop". It really does not matter either way I guess. Depending on ride height, shock drop, and other factors, you can also fine tune the ride height by adjusting how far/deep into the wheel carrier the shock body is positioned. There is some leeway there. Hope that helps.

Last edited by powdrhound; 01-18-2024 at 04:33 AM.
The following users liked this post:
changster123 (01-18-2024)
Old 01-18-2024, 12:19 PM
  #49  
996FLT6
Rennlist Member
 
996FLT6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: san francisco
Posts: 14,018
Received 236 Likes on 192 Posts
Default

Many good advice here 👍🏻❤️. Anyway imo rather then start adding mods I would keep it stock and if any stock items are possible to rebuild back to stock specs I go that route. Since this is your first outing I get it to stock spec suspension and all and do baseline track times and record track times THEN start adding if you think you almost maximized what stock can do. But I agree suspension add insult are key to a beautiful track car that makes you learn. Best learning experience ever 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻. Enjoy!!!
The following users liked this post:
changster123 (01-21-2024)
Old 01-21-2024, 09:22 AM
  #50  
changster123
Racer
Thread Starter
 
changster123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: CA and Taipei
Posts: 412
Received 71 Likes on 43 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by 996FLT6
Many good advice here 👍🏻❤️. Anyway imo rather then start adding mods I would keep it stock and if any stock items are possible to rebuild back to stock specs I go that route. Since this is your first outing I get it to stock spec suspension and all and do baseline track times and record track times THEN start adding if you think you almost maximized what stock can do. But I agree suspension add insult are key to a beautiful track car that makes you learn. Best learning experience ever 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻. Enjoy!!!
Thank you! Yes a damper rebuild I don't think would be expensive at all... and springs are cheap too.
Old 01-21-2024, 11:31 AM
  #51  
996FLT6
Rennlist Member
 
996FLT6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: san francisco
Posts: 14,018
Received 236 Likes on 192 Posts
Default

Forgot to ask how is the health of the lsd? Regards.
Old 01-21-2024, 05:19 PM
  #52  
changster123
Racer
Thread Starter
 
changster123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: CA and Taipei
Posts: 412
Received 71 Likes on 43 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by 996FLT6
Forgot to ask how is the health of the lsd? Regards.
The locking torque was 10Nm... the spec is 5-15Nm so I think it's still good.
Old 01-23-2024, 02:14 PM
  #53  
996FLT6
Rennlist Member
 
996FLT6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: san francisco
Posts: 14,018
Received 236 Likes on 192 Posts
Default

It will fail at some point and when it happens pretty scary. One .. rear wags like crazy late braking and 2nd can’t rotate on a dime.
The following users liked this post:
changster123 (01-23-2024)
Old 01-23-2024, 06:23 PM
  #54  
changster123
Racer
Thread Starter
 
changster123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: CA and Taipei
Posts: 412
Received 71 Likes on 43 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by 996FLT6
It will fail at some point and when it happens pretty scary. One .. rear wags like crazy late braking and 2nd can’t rotate on a dime.
Gotcha... will definitely keep it in mind!
Old 01-30-2024, 01:42 PM
  #55  
philrob1
Instructor
 
philrob1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 120
Received 65 Likes on 47 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by powdrhound
There were two front subframes for the street 996 cars, one for cars through 2001 and one for 2002 and later. They are NOT interchangeable. In other words, all front subframes on the 2002 and later 996GT2/3/TT/Cup are the same. The 996RSR used the same subframe casting but the LCA attachment point was milled and drilled 7mm higher resulting in higher roll centers to account for the lower ride height of the RSR. I had a few of these but sold them a couple of years ago. They are now NLA.

With that said, the standard 996 front subframe is perfectly fine. That is what I actually switched to from the RSR front subframe. We went even further on my car and lowered the roll center even more by using the short outer trunnion pin on the RSR LCAs. This helped with improving turning and mid corner understeer.

The rear standard subframes are shared between the 996GT2/3/Cup. The RSR again had a subframe milled with higher pick up points to account for the huge 710 rear tires. I am running the rear RS subframe which for all intents and purposes is the same as the standard subframe. The pick up points appear to be identical or nearly identical but the subframe is milled in areas for more clearance. I do not think there is much if anything to be gained by changing out the rear subframes from the standard to RS unless you want to do I for "completeness" of the conversion. With that said, the rear RS subframe's were actually very cheap years ago if I recall, around $1K for the pair.

The front 997 subframe does NOT fit a 996 tub.

Hope that helps.
To expand upon this bit I've highlighted in bold, whilst there is none (that I can see) pickup height chance, the clearance for the lower control arm is increased (more milled away) - and the angle upon which the eccentric operates when turning is different, which will have an effect on bump steer. I remember reading this 18 (!!) year old post about it and found it again the other day, so I thought I should add it here for completeness for anyone who wishes to do this conversion. Please note that the 996 GT3RS uses the split lower control arm (as found on the front) in the rear positions, unlike regular 996 GT3

996 RS Suspension Parts? - Page 2 - Rennlist - Porsche Discussion Forums - Post 21 and quoted:

"Correct, but the longer stroke goes on a 30 degrees angle. So, the less negative camber obtained by moving the control arm in, the better reduction in bump steer. After that re-adjust for more negative camber with shims on the two pieces RS control arm (and this increases track), then re-adjust toe, because adding rear camber shims increases toe out (opposite to the front that increases toe-in)"

Last edited by philrob1; 01-30-2024 at 01:47 PM.
The following users liked this post:
changster123 (01-31-2024)
Old 01-31-2024, 03:35 PM
  #56  
Micaa
Banned
 
Micaa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2024
Posts: 12
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

car looks great.
The following users liked this post:
changster123 (01-31-2024)
Old 02-01-2024, 03:22 AM
  #57  
changster123
Racer
Thread Starter
 
changster123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: CA and Taipei
Posts: 412
Received 71 Likes on 43 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by rodneyr;[url=tel:19211681
19211681[/url]]Yes, the shocks can handle the stiffer springs. I have been tracking my car since 2006 and have over 150+ track days on the OEM shocks. I did upgrade to stiffer springs and will have to look up the rating. Another key is the alignment. The car is very sensitive to having the correct alignment which seems like you got that covered
Any luck on what spring rates you are running on OEM dampers? I’m curious.
Old 02-02-2024, 06:25 PM
  #58  
spiller
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
 
spiller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Posts: 2,533
Received 333 Likes on 204 Posts
Default

@changster123 with my car I went from stock 996 GT3 rates to Ohlins rates which are ~400 front, 800 rear. I then went up to 600 front and left the rears as they are. To get around that I would run rear sway bar on the stiffest setting versus one off full stiff on the front. The car is great on track like this. I like a responsive front end and there was too much delay in body control in fast corners with the stock and 400 front springs. The 600 definitely make for a lively front end and it’s not as good on choppy back roads, however it is more than comfortable enough to use on the street IME.

For ultimate handling performance on a track these cars are best with a closer match in front to rear spring rates IMO.

Last edited by spiller; 02-02-2024 at 06:27 PM.
The following users liked this post:
changster123 (02-02-2024)
Old 02-02-2024, 09:47 PM
  #59  
changster123
Racer
Thread Starter
 
changster123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: CA and Taipei
Posts: 412
Received 71 Likes on 43 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by spiller
@changster123 with my car I went from stock 996 GT3 rates to Ohlins rates which are ~400 front, 800 rear. I then went up to 600 front and left the rears as they are. To get around that I would run rear sway bar on the stiffest setting versus one off full stiff on the front. The car is great on track like this. I like a responsive front end and there was too much delay in body control in fast corners with the stock and 400 front springs. The 600 definitely make for a lively front end and it’s not as good on choppy back roads, however it is more than comfortable enough to use on the street IME.

For ultimate handling performance on a track these cars are best with a closer match in front to rear spring rates IMO.
Awesome. This was done on OEM dampers?
Old 02-04-2024, 08:52 AM
  #60  
GT2rainge
Racer
 
GT2rainge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 348
Received 7 Likes on 7 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by powdrhound
There were two front subframes for the street 996 cars, one for cars through 2001 and one for 2002 and later. They are NOT interchangeable. In other words, all front subframes on the 2002 and later 996GT2/3/TT/Cup are the same. The 996RSR used the same subframe casting but the LCA attachment point was milled and drilled 7mm higher resulting in higher roll centers to account for the lower ride height of the RSR. I had a few of these but sold them a couple of years ago. They are now NLA.

With that said, the standard 996 front subframe is perfectly fine. That is what I actually switched to from the RSR front subframe. We went even further on my car and lowered the roll center even more by using the short outer trunnion pin on the RSR LCAs. This helped with improving turning and mid corner understeer.

The rear standard subframes are shared between the 996GT2/3/Cup. The RSR again had a subframe milled with higher pick up points to account for the huge 710 rear tires. I am running the rear RS subframe which for all intents and purposes is the same as the standard subframe. The pick up points appear to be identical or nearly identical but the subframe is milled in areas for more clearance. I do not think there is much if anything to be gained by changing out the rear subframes from the standard to RS unless you want to do I for "completeness" of the conversion. With that said, the rear RS subframe's were actually very cheap years ago if I recall, around $1K for the pair.

The front 997 subframe does NOT fit a 996 tub.

Hope that helps.
Hi John, thanks for that confirmed what is thought too be honest.

Thanks is for sharing your vast knowledge as always 👍



Quick Reply: First track outing



All times are GMT -3. The time now is 12:33 AM.