Heel & Toe or Toe & Heel with the 996 GT3 - Which way around?

[Juha G]

Ì've tried both ways;

1. toes on the brake and heel on the gas
2. toes partially on the brakes and partially on the gas.

On street #2 seems to work better for me but at the track I noticed I was slipping my foot from the break pedal too easily. That's very scary when coming down from +150mph at turn one at Moroso. Hence I have tried the option #1 also but it seems almost impossible to get my heel comfortably on the gas and I ended up getting jerky downshifts and braking...

On the other hand, a friend of mine who is a very experienced driver, had no problems heel & toe'ing using method #1 in my car.

Is it just me and my crumpy legs or which method do you guys use on the 996 GT3???

Any input/help would be appreciated as this is technique I definately want/need to master!

Thanks!

Juha

[Jim H.]

I don't use my heel at all. I just have my right foot half on the brake and then roll the other half onto the gas to match revs on a downshift.

[Juha G]

Originally Posted by Jim H.

I don't use my heel at all. I just have my right foot half on the brake and then roll the other half onto the gas to match revs on a downshift.

That's what I tried describe my method #2 to be... It works for me on the street but with hard braking + my driving shoes it feels too slippery.
Maybe I just need more practise...

But I'm still interested if someone uses method #1 on their 996 GT3...?

[GT3 Chuck]

perhaps some pedals with rubber knobs in them would help...

Carnewal

[Rob in VA]

Originally Posted by Jim H.

I don't use my heel at all. I just have my right foot half on the brake and then roll the other half onto the gas to match revs on a downshift.

+1. With some practice and you'll be fine.

[guykoken]

I agree with Jim H.

I describe it to my DE students as "Ball and Side", rather than "Heel and Toe". When setting up for it, your right foot overlaps the right edge of the brake pedal, with most of the ball of the foot making contact with the brake pedal. To blip, you twist your ankle to push the accelerator down with the side of your right foot, with most of the contact with the accelerator being at the widest part of the foot just below the baby toe.The edge of the heel of the right foot is resting on the floor throughout, aft of the bottom of the accelerator, about where it would be when you're driving normally.

If you have narrow feet, a thin piece of metal can be screwed to the left side of the accelerator to extend its width by about an inch.

There is one catch with this method. Under VERY hard braking, the right side of the foot might make contact with, and accordingly inadvertently press slightly on, the accelerator. To avoid that, if braking very hard with your right foot in this position, consciously tilt your foot to the left whilst braking.

This method is easy to learn and produces smooth downshifts, as the heel remains the pivot point.

Richard Bain

[Blacksport350]

Originally Posted by Jim H.

I don't use my heel at all. I just have my right foot half on the brake and then roll the other half onto the gas to match revs on a downshift.

Jim, I hate to tell you this, but your foot is on backwards! Sorry, I couldn't resist!

I use the ball of my foot on the brake and blip the throttle with the side of my foot in the GT3.

[ArcticFox]

Originally Posted by Blacksport350

I use the ball of my foot on the brake and blip the throttle with the side of my foot in the GT3.

That's what I do as well.

[Rob in VA]

This is the proper heel-toe-shift technique.
Watch and learn.
http://videos.streetfire.net/search/...1d013d364b.htm

[LVDell]

I have called what I do "toe-toe" and works like a champ!

http://forums.rennlist.com/rennforum...d.php?t=294366

[Jim H.]

Originally Posted by Blacksport350

Jim, I hate to tell you this, but your foot is on backwards! Sorry, I couldn't resist!

I use the ball of my foot on the brake and blip the throttle with the side of my foot in the GT3.

Yeah I was born that way. Pretty cheezy of you to make fun of it...

[aeGT3]

Originally Posted by Juha G

Ì've tried both ways;

1. toes on the brake and heel on the gas
2. toes partially on the brakes and partially on the gas.

On street #2 seems to work better for me but at the track I noticed I was slipping my foot from the break pedal too easily. That's very scary when coming down from +150mph at turn one at Moroso. Hence I have tried the option #1 also but it seems almost impossible to get my heel comfortably on the gas and I ended up getting jerky downshifts and braking...

On the other hand, a friend of mine who is a very experienced driver, had no problems heel & toe'ing using method #1 in my car.

Is it just me and my crumpy legs or which method do you guys use on the 996 GT3???

Any input/help would be appreciated as this is technique I definately want/need to master!

Thanks!

Juha

The technique to use depends on a number of variables including: a) the width of your RT foot/shoe, b) the proximity of the accelerator to the brake pedals (lateral as well as height differences), and c) your musculoskeletal and orthopedic status. You may have to try the different recommended methods to determine which one is the best for you (i.e, comfortable, effective and reproducible) for a particular car (GT3). You can certainly master the technique with practice.
It is very hard for me personally to use the technique #2 in GT3 and other Porsche cars, but the same method is quite staisfactory in Audi S4. I have been doing the so-called "heal and toe" in the past 20 yrs, double-clutching approximately 90% of the time.

[LVDell]

Originally Posted by aeGT3

double-clutching approximately 90% of the time.

why do you feel the need to double clutch in a GT3? You do realize you have synchro's that do that job automatically?

[aeGT3]

Originally Posted by LVDell

why do you feel the need to double clutch in a GT3? You do realize you have synchro's that do that job automatically?

Your post has 2 segments (a question and a comment) that I will attempt to address:

1. Your question is valid, legitimate and quite appropriate. Before providing a response, I do concede the following:
a) Is it necessary? Of course, NOT; b) In fact, it slows you down on the track (hell, most, if not all, GT3 cup cars and GT3 RSR have sequential gearboxes now (correct me if I am wrong); and c) this technique most likely induces increased wear and tear in the clutch.

Then why in the wolrd am I doing this? Simply because, for ME, it is fun and I enjoy it in my daily driving. BTW, the 90% applies to my daily driver, the GT3 is not the one. I certainly did not intend to suggest or reccommend anyone else to do this.

2. The second portion was a statement that provides affirmation of your legendary talent of limited ability to suppress your uncotrollable urge to lecture others. Any true enthusiast, perhaps even the one with limited cognitive ability, knows about the the function of synchronizers.

I do appreciate your question. However, I do not wish to pursue this discourse any further.

Warmest Regards,

[LVDell]

Originally Posted by aeGT3

2. The second portion was a statement that provides affirmation of your legendary talent of limited ability to suppress your uncotrollable urge to lecture others. Any true enthusiast, perhaps even the one with limited cognitive ability, knows about the the function of synchronizers.

I do appreciate your question. However, I do not wish to pursue this discourse any further.

Warmest Regards,

Don't be such a jack ass. I guess I needed to add the smiley face to my statement next time so you don't get your feelings hurt. When somebody says they double clutch and drive a GT3 but are not expressly specific about THEIR knowledge (or what car they are referring to since the GT3 is implied here) then asking them why they do it make sure they know about synchos is a VALID point but one you felt the need to read into it something that isn't there.

I had no idea how to change a brake pad or do and oil change or what weight was what much less what a syncho was before I started learning from the great P-Car community about my car when i became an enthusiast so there is no malice in my question to ask if you know about "x" and if you don't then attempt to explain it to give you the knowledge you might seek.

And knowing that you in fact are wrong in your attack of me you throw out the simple and passive aggressive "I don't want to talk about it any further" and "warmest regards" crack. What a child.

Geez.....you ask a simple question and the thin-skinned ones lose their mind and go into full attack mode.