Mark Dreyer

Some of you may have read my thread on the OT forum describing the incident in which a guy in a pickup jumped the curb, and took out my 01 TT which had been parked perpendicular to the road in the photo. Anyhow, I talked to the body shop guy and he said there is no suspension damage although the frame rail is "moved a little".

His preliminary damage estimate is $14k. If this figure holds, the insurance will probably fix rather than total it. My question is how to determine a diminished value figure?

An additional factor is that the wing nut who hit my car has a policy which caps at $10k, so my insurance will have to pay this claim and then go after that company for whatever they can get. There was damage to the building sign as well as substantial power and phone line damage requiring major man hours from local utility workers.

I have a very good relationship with my agent and the company (State Farm). They have been very standup with me over the years and I feel a bit bad to go this route with my own company. (They paid out over $300k on a house claim I had almost 10 years ago when a series of 3 hurricanes came through central Florida). Additionally I've been with my agent over 20 years, so I hate the idea of taking an aggressive stance with him. I guess I need to though for my own interests. Advise please!

Off to camp at Sebring for race week, and not sure about Internet coverage there so I will reply in a few days. Thanks!

Triangleturbo

At least he had 10k in liabilty. I am suprised Florida minimums are so low, but guess they are. It is not coming out of your agent's pocket - so don't worry too much about their well being.
Once payouts begin, tell your insurance about your concern for diminished value, have proof of value loss examples and give them a figure. Most likely they will say they cannot give you anything. Some insurance companies have a "pain and suffering"dept. and that is where it could ultimately end up coming from. Reject your payout offerings until they come back with something acceptable. Insurance is not in the business of making payouts, which is why they are so good at not doing it and we are so accepting of that.
This all comes from a very recent experience in which I received payout for nearly $4k over what their book maxed for similar reasoning.
Hopefully we will all find out that underinsured coverage does the job!
Best wishes - sorry for your misfortune!

Misplacedyankee

I hired a service (when I lived in Dallas) that put together a report for diminished value. I am sure you could google DV claim in your area to find an adjuster. It was well done and cost me like $250. They use comparables and reduction in blue book etc. That was 10 years ago so not sure where the report is at this point, but I got $1500 out of it thru the other driver's insurance which I believe was State Farm. I had no frame damage mind you, but the car was rare. The fact that your fram rail "moved a little" would be a much larger DV claim.

I agree that you can be upfront with your state farm agent. Its not his money and he should be helpful. I would be surprised if he wasn't.

Good luck. Enjoy the camp. That should take your mind of it a bit.

Macster

That $14K estimate is too low.

According to PCNA to be properly repaired requires parts be bought from PCNA through an authorized dealer. All mechanical work should be done by a tech working for an authorized dealer.

Somewhere online is a document that describes what a Porsche Collision Center should provide, right down to the flavor of coffee in the waiting room.

The frame rail "moved a little" is serious. The car needs to be disassembled enough and placed on a Celette Bench and this "frame rail" brought into proper position. This takes time. And of course it requires a shop have a Celette Bench. The jigs/fixtures used to determine hard point locations are rented from Celette. Then of course the shop must have someone who knows how to use the bench and it granted the time to do the job right.

It is the Celette bench time where insurance companies balk. At the expense of a substandard repair.

For the other driver's insurance... I had to write a letter threatening in an indirect fashion the assets of the driver of the car that hit and destroyed my new Cayman S when it proved she had less insurance than necessary to cover the cost of the car. $50K insurance limit yet she hit/destroyed a $60K car.

The insurance company came through with around $45K and I retained salvage rights to the car, which I sold at a salvage car auction (the car by this time had a salvage title) for more money than the insurance company had estimated the car was worth and I was made whole again.

Not sure if this is an action you should take. Sometimes one plays it by ear.

For diminished value the chances are your insurance company will have a clause in your policy fine print that disallows DV claims.

Regardless, if the car is going to be repaired your primary task is to ensure it is repaired as good as humanly possible so if there is any DV it is as small can it can ever be.

Another way at looking at this how much money would you require to live with a badly repaired car, one that ate tires because of a bent chassis that was not straightened and the alignment could not be brought into spec?

How much money would you require to live with a badly repaired car that had misfitting body panels, with odd wind noises, or water leaks arising from these fits?

How much money would you require to live with a badly repaired car that had other mechanical or electrical problems due to substandard repairs?

Last930

I recall State Farm sending me a notice that they would not pay a diminished value claim on my car if it were damaged and repaired. I assume that would be the case if I damaged it; if it was damaged by somebody else then I would go after their insurance or them personally to pay the claim. You might need to talk with a lawyer who has experience with these issues in your state, as the law varies state-by-state.

Another P

Many good thoughts and opinion. My sister was an attorney for State Farm in major claims, which sometimes included vehicles as a portion of a claim. Suffice to say that they are a for profit business. They have protocols to mitigate your recovery. You DO have the ability to reject offers, and candidly, I would push for totaling the vehicle because as posted above, the car needs to be brought back to spec, and that price simply cannot reflect a Porsche approved repair facility. Just the mention of bringing legal counsel to protect your interests will give SF some thought to your seriousness. They can and DO negotiate. There is rarely a take it or leave it approach, especially with a long time client. So be patient, be firm with your intentions and legitimate desires, and begin the arduous journey of "negotiating" with a company that you know in advance does not really have your best interests in mind, no matter what you believe.
It can be done.

2K7TTMIA

+996 on totalling the car.

Sounds like the experience I had with Geico. The individual that hit my Cab, was fully covered by Geico, but the supervisor basically offered my third party DV claim by half ($3.5 from $7k). $15K repair bill. I was too PO and tired after a 4 month repair on my car that I didn't want to even start with bringing an attorney into the discussion.

And had I just pushed for a total, I would have ended up making a bit more than when I resold the car. Geico estimated the replacement cost of my Cab at $33k back in Sept 2011! I should have jumped on that in retrospect.

SSST

If you have guarateed insurability with SF, then I would go for diminished value. If not, and in light of your homeowner's claim, then I would consider whether the juice is worth the squeeze. I know in Texas, guaranteed insurability is worth it's weight in gold figuratively speaking.

I'm also with SF and have GI. That has saved me a lot of money on my Bayhouse in Galveston.

Mark Dreyer

There has not been a decision to total the car. Additionally my insurance adjuster wants to use used parts to repair my car rather than new. Do I have any leverage to force the use of new parts? I told the body shop guy not do do anything as I am considering having an attorney get involved. Obviously at $400/hour it doesn't make sense to involve the attorney to any extent, but I was hoping a phone call/letter might be useful. I also have a call in to an expert whose business is providing diminished value estimates on cars like mine. What are my options at this point?

Macster

The leverage you have is that Porsche states to properly repair the car to put it back into what Porsche considers roadworthy condition -- and an inspection to determine this is part of the repair process -- Porsche states that no used/salvaged parts can be used, only new parts, bought from PCNA and through a Porsche dealership parts department, and all technical/mechanical work must be done by an authorized Porsche tech.

Remind the insurance company it charged you Porsche rates/premiums for your insurance. It can't then turn around and limit repairs to that of a Ford Festiva.

Read up on insurance rules/regulations (fair settlement something or other) in your state but suggest that if the insurance company insists on a cheap repair that this could be consumer/insurance fraud.

Charging you Porsche sized premiums and implying the car would be repaired properly then insisting on what the maker of the car would consider a sub-par repair is fraud.

Point out that car would be be repaired and the road worthiness inspection fails the car and the car would be declared unsafe and thus unusable.

How would the insurance company like to pay to have the car repaired wrong, then again and this time right? Also there is your inconvenience and the extended loss of the use of your most enjoyable car.

Mark Dreyer

I just called my agent and related some of the points you made Macster. The agent will be calling me back. His secretary said that "your car is 12 yrs old" in trying to explain why they try to go as cheap as possible.

SSST

Explain to them that it is not a car. It's a Porsche.

It doesn't matter how old it is. It's the value of the car versus the cost to put it back to its pre-crash condition.

Mark Dreyer

I presume there is contractual language in my policy green lighting them to cheap out on this repair. I am going to make like a squeeky wheel anyhow.

SSST

My wife's GL450 was hit in a parking lot a few month's back by an uninsured motorist. She took it to the MB dealer for repair. 10 years ago a delivery van ran me off the road and their insurance refused to pay to have it properly fixed. SF paid the claim ($28K) and then successfully subrogated (sp?) the other company and returned my deductible. SF paid both of those without any hassle.

Maybe their policies have changed, but I'm not sure why they would be giving you a hard time.

Macster

The secretary has no say in this matter. But have her put it in writing. She won't but you can use this if she does.

I'd really not waste time in this matter talking with her. And I'd switch to face to face or mail/email so you have a paper trail.

Get it in writing the insurance company is balking at fixing the car properly.

Point out the insurance policy has the VIN of the car. It is not like you tried to hide the car's make.

It is not your fault if the insurance company failed to take into account what it would cost to fix the vehicle properly should this situation arise.

There is no where on the policy that states you were getting discounted premium because the insurance company was going to use substandard repairs to save some money in the event of a claim.

Tell the agent the insurance company can go as cheap as it can with other insured cars but not yours.

You paid Porsche premiums all these years and you want the car fixed and fixed to Porsche standards. You want to be made whole again.

A substandard repair adds insult to injury.

Put this in writing.

You might want to CC the head of the insurance commission in your state along with the consumer fraud division in your area.

You want the car fixed to Porsche standards or you want it in writing it will not be fixed to Porsche standards and why.

Last but not least be aware the insurance agent might be monitoring your posts here and wherever else you post.