PV997

Completely agree with the tech, it's just more expensive stuff to break that doesn't add a lot of value. You would have thought Porsche would have learned from the BWM experience where ten year old cars now are almost worthless as everything is broken and insanely expensive to fix. The ultimate driving machine is now broken down, unreliable German crap. The public does seem to love their gadgets though, and there are no shortage of BMW buyers for the time being at least.

As to the quality I don't think the problem is what we typically picture (poor workmanship, ill fitting panels, etc.) but insufficient development. Mainly for environmental reasons the manufacturers are being forced to adopt processes and materials that just aren't ready for prime time. Processes like cyanide electro-plating have been banned without suitable alternatives. Fuel consumption mandates are driving increased use of aluminum and plastic to reduce weight, and they just aren't the best material for the job in many cases.

It's affecting all manufacturers and will likely result in cars that are disposable after ten years. Porsche isn't immune from it unfortunately.

Petza914

Agree as well. The 928s are just simpler and the parts are more robust - metal pipes where new cars use plastic, mechanical air valves instead of a computer box, etc. Don't get me wrong - my 997 is my favorite of my Porsches, I just won't be buying any newer than my 09 Cayenne. Hard to believe they've been making newer Porsches I don't have much interest in for over a decade.

Bruce In Philly

2009 C2S 188K miles

It is just the circa 1997-2008 vintage.... cheapened due to financial problems... 2009 and on, I think they are back in the game.

I attended a presentation by Vic Elford at the Simeone museum a few years back... he told a story when he first drove a 911 in a race circa mid(?) 1960s... had driven Fords before that... support truck showed up with one guy and half empty van with tires and not much else. Vic said something like "where are the parts?" .... mechanic said "don't need them". No matter what 2009 and after... those old days are gone for good. Complexity equals problems and... well those old cars were not complex.

Peace,
Bruce in Philly (now Atlanta)

PV997

I've got his 1980's era book, "Porsche High Performance Driving Handbook" where he relates the same story (which despite the title includes a great history of those days back in the 60's). "Porsches don't break" IIRC was the quote from the mechanic when pressed on it. The book has great pictures including the Targa Florio with spectators standing mere feet from the racers. A different era, the old days for certain. Elford was one-of-a-kind, a smart but straight-forward guy who just got it done (much like the 911's of the day).

ADias

And you think Taycan is fault free? What about a potential battery fire? If that happens let's hope the car sits outside, otherwise the house goes up in flames too, as the FD will not stop Li-Ion fires. Pick your poison. Life is short to live in fear about everything.

qikqbn

Disaster? Really? What percentage of any mechanical object breaking down should be considered a disaster? Do we really know the numbers of how many 997's have suffered bore scoring? The answer is obviously no, and even if we give it a very high percentage of, hypothetically speaking, let's say 10%, that is still not even close to disaster levels. Unfortunate, yes, but will all 997/987 eventually need an engine rebuild due to bore scoring? I doubt it, because we can not know how each car is taken care of by the previous owners, but let's not forget the oldest 997's are almost 20 years old now and 300,000+ were built. Name any other car manufacturer or generation of 911 that will not need some kind of love and care at 20+ years old. I mean, it's kind of ridiculous to assume all things will last forever. I hate to say, but there have been many 997's that have outlasted the life of their owners. Nothing is guaranteed. There is not a single car or object out there that can be driven like a Porsche day in and day out and not expect to have some kind of engine refresh or major maintenance at some point in it's life. Life long expectancy of any object or car with absolutely no issues is silly.

At this point in the game I have owned many water-cooled Porsches for over 23 years and over 400,000 miles driven and I have never had any engine issues. With that said, I also am prepared for that unfortunate day when it comes, but I would rather fix what I have, then spend an insane amount of money on cars full of electrical gadgets and software that will bring nothing but headaches down the road. GT3's are no exception. Let's not forget the major fiasco that happened with the 991.1 GT3 engine and the major loss of money Porsche took on that engine. Any GT3 driven the way it was intended will eventually need a refresh as well. Just going back to my original point. There are no guarantees in life. Get out and drive and enjoy what you have. Life is short.

Doug H

Lol, living in Memphis makes people like this. Ghetto war zone PTSD . . . I had (3) 996 TT and used all 3 as daily drivers putting 30,000 to 68,000 on each (averaged 20,000 plus a year) and one had 750 hp. They were bullet proof for me. Mezgers are great if maintained and that motor in your 996TT was same as the GT3 engine you say you would have.

Just saw this article recognizing the .2 as on the most indestructible sports cars so it is not just us enthusiasts recognizing the near bullet proof nature of the 911 (with an engine other than the M96/97).

10 Indestructible Sports Cars Worth Every Penny (msn.com)

I had maybe 30 to 40 911s (many new, many old) and definitely the M97 motors in my opinion was the biggest black mark on Porsche, None if the others bother me. I was on here saying that most would end up with scoring back in 2016/17 even before Raby said so in a 2017ish video he put out. I heard that through inner channels as well and stayed completely away from them despite really wanting a low mileage 2008 Aero kit to put back long term. M96/97s were chronic disasters even back when new. I drove turbos 20 years ago, but seemed like 1 in 5 new NA 996s were having RMS failures back in 2002/2003 and many were getting Lemmon lawed because they could not stop the dripping. Then the IMS and now scoring. It’s just been a bad motor from day 1, but I really think the 9A1s are pretty solid and would have another .2 GTS without any concerns whatsoever.

I think overall Porsche are the best built, best handling, daily deliverable sport car ever made. I think they are just as reliable as anything on the road even pedestrian family Truckster mode vehicles. We also drive them hard, much harder than a soccer mom or CPA nerd drive their Accord or Camry.

Things will break and things go wrong with them as they age, but so do the other sports car brands. It’s just the nature of the beast and you got to pay to play to get this kind of performance.

I do think the 911s have gotten more and more reliable the newer they have gotten (post 2008) and they are much better and more solid. The new ones are truly super car performance with daily drive ability.

PV997

It's a drive-bye post intended to inflame emotions with little substance. Throw out a bunch of unsupported accusations, peppered with a few anecdotes, and sit back and watch people seethe in response.

I'm a contrarian myself in that I almost never accept the conventional wisdom and like to dig deeper. But if you are going to upset the apple cart you need to have facts behind it. Trashing the whole brand over a few reliability issues isn't going to fly. Engineers aren't perfect and flaws often don't surface until years later, unfortunately it happens. It happens to Porsche too but a lot less than their high-end competitors.