Originally Posted by ds2k1

Difference is that airline tickets are purchased in an antiseptic, take-it-or-leave-it kind of environment...you either buy them online or on the phone, typically, and there's no haggling, no relationship, no value-add from the sales person. As a result, the airline doesn't try to play you...they just tell you the price at any given time of day and you can pay it or not. What pisses people off about car salesmen is that they have a tendency to try to play to each person's weakness and lack of information...they're manipulative. The less informed you are, the more they try to squeeze out of you using practices (tricks) you don't understand. They've got a million different ways to screw you that aren't transparent...the airline doesn't. Thus, there's inherent manipulation built into the system...caveat emptor. Well, it tends to **** people off when someone cozy's up the them, pretends to be their friend, says they're working their hardest to get you the best deal, etc., only to find out later that that very same "friend" was really a wolf in sheep's clothing and that the person that came in right before or after you got a better deal simply because they couldn't squeeze them in as many ways. Any relationship like that breeds distrust. Airlines don't have that same dynamic.

If sales people could simply say, "today the price of a Porsche is $___...would you like one?", then there would be less distrust and loathing. But they won't do that because they know that they don't have to. Some customers will be savvy and informed enough to get a better price, but there's also a sucker born every minute that will come along and pay a lot more. So you don't show your cards. Who really wants to play poker when buying a car?

Originally Posted by Trader220

Everyone in the world is out to get you and screw you and steal your money, there are ZERO honest sales people in the car business.

Originally Posted by ds2k1

No, no...not what I meant at all. Don't protest so much, man, I'm not making any personal comments here. I'm simply pointing out why I think people don't really trust car salesmen and why it's a different dynamic than purchasing an airline ticket. Like any profession, there are good salesmen and bad ones. I have no opinion as to which side of that equation you fall. Merely pointing out a dynamic in the purchase and sale of cars that tends to breed distrust and hard feelings. You can play it that way or not, but it doesn't change the fact that it's a very common dynamic in your business. If you're the good kind, good on ya.

Originally Posted by Trader220

I guess not everyone sees it that way, you're basically saying guilty until proven innocent. IMO thats a crappy way to go through life.

Originally Posted by Likemystoppie?

Howard-I don't think he's saying that at all mang.

We sell cars. Lot's of people think they're A) better B) Smarter C) make more money then we do) and overall are just D) a Higher Life Form.



This place has gotten really hostile as of late. I'm not making excuses for myself as I've 'pitched in' my own fuel on this fire. But apparently it's open season on car salesman/sales people ect.

But ds2k1 means no harm.

Originally Posted by brendorenn

i spoke to 5 dealers when i bought my car. i talked about pricing, and product. they were fair and reasonable wrt exposing their costs. Three of them seemed like organiziations with whom i'd like to do business. in the end, i bought off the lot, added a few options (PSE, center painted console). my salesman wishes i'd paid more, i wish i'd paid less. in the end, i got a great product at a great price.

at no point, did anybody accuse me of being superior to them, call me a douchebag, or use any of this bull**** vitriol.

in my business, there are probaby 100x more forums where people discuss our products than porsche. if my empolyees responded in the manner that some of the sales reps respond here, we'd terminate them at the end of the day. period. if my customers came in with the attacks we the porsche reps see here, we'd be pissed, but certainly respond differently.

i just left a customer call where the customer wants to pay $18k for a $132 solution. that's not going to work. i didn't insult the guy though. hey, i'm sorry we won't be selling to him. i don't blame him for trying.

this forum is made up of the most educated, enlightened enthusists in the porsche ecosystem. get used to it. getting asked hard questions and responding professionally isn't for everybody apparently.