End to the oil change after break-in debate
12-24-2009, 09:37 PM
#121
Race Director
I'm sure manufacturers have already performed long term testing of the "low maintenance" schedule on a sufficiently large statistical sample size to confidently arrive at the recommendations they've made.
It would be absurd for them to make this recommendation without knowing beforehand how it will play out in the long run - the useful life of an engine.
It would be absurd for them to make this recommendation without knowing beforehand how it will play out in the long run - the useful life of an engine.
Admittedly I'm working on memory but I recall that even serpentine or v-belts or even rubber timing belts not allowed to be changed. (I came across this info when I owned a VW Golf TDi that required a timing belt change at 80K miles and was wondering how much margin there was in the belt at 80K miles which is why this belt change prohibition sticks in my mind.)
The test is done on a closed course -- oval and not a road course -- and to cut down on the time it takes to reach 100K miles high speed is used.
Not as strenuous a test as one might think cause the engine doesn't have to deal with cold starts, idling, short trips in cold weather, and so on, IOWs lots of other useages that give engines fits and shorten their lives.
Also, I know used cars are collected from private owners -- with their permission -- and tested at various EPA sites around country and especially in Michigan to monitor older vehicles and their emissions characteristics at various mileages.
Sincerely,
Macster.
12-24-2009, 09:48 PM
#122
Banned
So company spokesman, Bill Kwong, whispered in your ear at dinner once that "They experimented with higher [oil change interval] levels and failed."?
For all we know he could have looked at you and thought to himself, "Here is one gullible individual who'll believe anything I tell him, watch this."
Sorry, try again.
The fact is, Toyota doesn't use synthetic oil in their cars like BMW and Porsche. So you're really comparing apples to oranges here.
Btw, how's that snake oil purchase of yours working out for you? Getting any good results with it , are you? It might take a few more bottles before the effects kick in, so I wouldn't give up on it just yet if I were you.
For all we know he could have looked at you and thought to himself, "Here is one gullible individual who'll believe anything I tell him, watch this."
Sorry, try again.
The fact is, Toyota doesn't use synthetic oil in their cars like BMW and Porsche. So you're really comparing apples to oranges here.
Btw, how's that snake oil purchase of yours working out for you? Getting any good results with it , are you? It might take a few more bottles before the effects kick in, so I wouldn't give up on it just yet if I were you.
12-24-2009, 09:52 PM
#123
Banned
Wouldn't count on it. Automakers to get certification to sell engines in USA have to of course meet emissions requirements but beyond that all that is required is a representative sample of the engine is a legitimate car be driven 100K miles with only scheduled oil/filter and possibly air filter services.
12-24-2009, 09:56 PM
#125
Banned
Because it might be upstream of the oil filter.
I guess the best way to answer that is to see an actual oil circulation diagram of the engine.
If the oil flows down into the drain pan and then through the filter to get cleaned and then up the higher pressure side to make another circulation cycle, my guess is that the magnet is catching the ferrous-based metals before the filter has a chance to catch them. In other words, the magnet is upstream of the filter.
Obviously the filter will catch all debris whether or not it's from ferrous-based metals, whereas the magnet will not.
If the oil flows down into the drain pan and then through the filter to get cleaned and then up the higher pressure side to make another circulation cycle, my guess is that the magnet is catching the ferrous-based metals before the filter has a chance to catch them. In other words, the magnet is upstream of the filter.
Obviously the filter will catch all debris whether or not it's from ferrous-based metals, whereas the magnet will not.
12-24-2009, 10:30 PM
#126
Pro
Thread Starter
Uhmmm, Ben.....did you forget the origin of Toyota in this thread?
See post #1 for the topic - stick with it.
12-24-2009, 10:56 PM
#128
Banned
Any more brilliant deductions...............Sherlock?
The name is OCBen, in case you're having trouble reading text. And no, I did not "forget the origin of Toyota in this thread."
I was answering a particular poster's question that was addressed specifically to me about what is considered useful life of an engine.
Run along Junior. You've just proven you are out of your league here when it comes to intelligent discussion.
The name is OCBen, in case you're having trouble reading text. And no, I did not "forget the origin of Toyota in this thread."
I was answering a particular poster's question that was addressed specifically to me about what is considered useful life of an engine.
Run along Junior. You've just proven you are out of your league here when it comes to intelligent discussion.
12-25-2009, 01:19 AM
#129
Perhaps one might rightly think the magnet takes the ferrous particles out of circulation before the filter would. If those particles were to disconnect from the magnet they would get caught by the filter.
If the magnet does no harm, it can only do some good by indicating problems without having to change and dissect your filter at every frequent oil change. Whatever. I personally don't care enough to buy and install one; can't speak for everybody else here.
BTW, If using one voids the warranty don't do it.
If the magnet does no harm, it can only do some good by indicating problems without having to change and dissect your filter at every frequent oil change. Whatever. I personally don't care enough to buy and install one; can't speak for everybody else here.
BTW, If using one voids the warranty don't do it.
12-25-2009, 12:29 PM
#132
12-25-2009, 12:40 PM
#133
As you probably know, synthetic oil (like Mobil 1) doesn't break down like conventional oil. It will last something like 12,000 to 15,000 miles compared to 3,000-5000 for regular oil. Definitely dump it after a year if low mileage, but it seems a shame to dump it after only 2K miles.
12-25-2009, 12:44 PM
#134
Advanced
Wonder why Porsche and many other auto makers spend so much money on race teams. I would imagine that it would be a great way to test there visions in a way they could produce better, faster, safer cars. I have a feeling the car makers have one up on all of us.
12-25-2009, 12:48 PM
#135
Pro
Thread Starter
As you probably know, synthetic oil (like Mobil 1) doesn't break down like conventional oil. It will last something like 12,000 to 15,000 miles compared to 3,000-5000 for regular oil. Definitely dump it after a year if low mileage, but it seems a shame to dump it after only 2K miles.
As to break-in, I believe in a break-in oil service and others don't (that's cool).
In the BlackStone report, they recommended swapping the oil at the next 2k interval for my motor more as a precaution due to the high metal count on the first 2k, post break-in.