TRAKCAR

I have a deposit on a mk2 gt3rs, I do not want PDK, but surely it will be optional at 80-90lbs extra??

If not maybe the PDK is so popular that will lower the price of an mk1 RS, so I can get that one instead.

SpeedGeek

It will definitely be an option, but for how long? Only 3% of Ferraris are now ordered with manual boxes. I bet Ferrari soon stops offering manual at all.

If Porsche continues playing to the gold-chain crowd more than to the enthusiast, you can expect the same future for their manual box. Get 'em while you can.

340Elise

Yes, but did Ferrari ever make a good, fun shifting, manual tranny? I was always under the impression that their gated manual tyranny’s were just horribly slow with long throws and other problems. Then they came out with the F1 gearbox (while still building horrible regular manual shifting cars) and it really was a welcome alternative. It not only allowed for much, much faster shifts, but it also made it more fun because the regular manual just wasn't that much fun. It was more of a choir and they never had anything close to a short throw snickety shifter like we have in today's GT3 or even the older air cooled911's.

And then with the F1 technology just getting better and better due to what they learned from racing, and having the bugs worked out of it (I think the first F1 gearboxes in production cars had some serious reliability issues; in a Ferrari??? Never! But were still much more fun than the manuals when they worked.), they now have the best sequential manual gearbox that works very well in the newest Ferrari's

And since they became more and more popular, Ferrari did not see a need to improve upon the manual gearboxes, especially if your statistic of 3% is correct. They would be wasting development dollars.

But Porsche still does not have a hi-tech alternative to the old manual tranny, and their latest iterations in all of their sports cars are excellent gearboxes and clutches with excellent modulation and a shifter that is about as good as the one of the best in the industry: the precise, snickity shifter of the Honda S2000.

Our GT3 clutches require more effort than the other Porsche cars including the turbo, but unless you are really a wuss, or only get to drive the car in stop and go traffic (then you need to sell your GT3 to someone who will properly use it) it is the best clutch I have ever experienced in ANY car. It is extremely easy to drive smoothly because you know exactly what is going on and it is weighted properly. And the RS clutch with the LWFW is even better in that it allows for the faster engine revs in both directions and makes for fun rev matching down shifts. And the shifter also requires more effort than the rest of the Porsche cars, but it is still very direct, precise, and with short throws. I have heard it being compared to a quality rifle bolt action and I can't say I disagree. It is the best shifting car with the best clutch that I have ever driven, and this is what makes it so enjoyable as a manual transmission car.

I can see the new PDK being popular to some for various reasons. The best reason being that it might allow someone who is disabled to not get stuck with a 997 turbo with an automatic transmission; no one should be put through that kind of hell; is it not bad enough that the person is missing a limb??? Then you have the guys who are mostly track rats and do find the PDK to give them a performance advantage not only with the faster shifts, but it allows them to concentrate more on braking and taking the proper race lines and other things. I don't see anything wrong with that, and let them have this technology if that is what they want. But there will always be a very large percentage of Porsche owners who want a traditional manual, especially one as good as in the current 997 GT3 cars, and will not give up their clutch pedal and H pattern like gear shifting selection and rev matching and h&ting and just mastering perfectly executed up shifts and downshifts. Don't worry, we are not dying bread, at least not for some time to come; not in my lifetime I don't see it unless it is government mandated for safety reasons.

And some of you, such as C.J., will probably end up with dedicated track cars with the faster shifter PDK after you spend some time with it, and a traditional manual for your daily driver Porsche also used for some fun mountain runs. And there will also be a large percentage who I think will try the PDK and really enjoy it and order it on their next Porsche. Then after some time (2 weeks to 6 months) get bored with it and find it to simply be a gimmick that seemed really cool at first, but they really miss their traditional manual add will go back to that on their next car.

If PDK orders got up to 97% over the years, then yes, you need to worry about losing your traditional manual; but I assure you that will not happen.

SpeedGeek

Stephen, I agree with your entire essay, except that I'm less confident that the enthusiast is important anymore. PDK will be the overwhelming choice of serious track junkies, and for good reason (although weight will turn some of them off). It will also be the overwhelming choice of Porsche's main target market - rich guys buying the brand and lifestyle. That will leave just a shrinking minority group of old-school sports car enthusiasts who will continue to want a 6-speed stick.

I hope I'm wrong, but I predict the 6-speed will soon be seen as old, pointless technology, its proponents dinosaurs. I give the manual 5, maybe 10 years (2 model generations).

Jack

I'm down for the first DI/PDK GT3RS at my dealer -- looking forward to it.

After having driven BMW's twin-clutch tranny in my friend's just delivered M3, if Porsche's PDK is anything like it -- what a fantastic transmission.

Any weight penalty will be more than made up for by the speed of the shifts, never bouncing off the rev-limiter, always having perfectly rev-matched downshifts and the elimination of any missed downshifts.

SpeedGeek

See what I mean!

I was out today hammering in my RS, perfect heel-toe downshifts putting a huge, ear-to-ear grin on my face. I thought of this thread and realized just how much I'm going to miss manual if I opt for PDK.

And Jack, even if PDK shifts can make up for an extra 85 lbs of fat in terms of lap times, the never-ending weight creep is robbing our cars of FUN.

C.J. Ichiban

don't worry guys- we all have manual transmissions in our cars now...just keep them!

Jack

Don't worry, we'll save you a "real man's" manual tranny, so you can have fun. After all, variety is the spice of life.

OldGuy

Rev limiter?! Whos ever bounced off the rev limiter?? NOT ME!!!!!

while passing a Ferrari on the hwy ....NO WAY!!!

340Elise

Do you think Jack cares? He is a very wise man; check out his avatar sometime and I think you will figure it out. Now that is a real car!

SpeedGeek

Actually I have been seriously considering buying an Exige S 240. I figure a PDK GT3 for daily use and an Exige for weekend fun could be a good combo.

BTW Jack, it's not the man in me who wants the manual box, it's the kid.

Jack

It's good to stay young.... you've found the fountain of youth.

I'm an old guy, so just trying to get into my Exige Cup satisfies my daily requirement for stretching.

mooty

i wouldn't know when to upshift then.
the fuel cut off is my cue

mooty

you are way too modest, jack.
i only wish i can stay healthy and have such a great outlook when i grow up

va122

Hey Jack,

Are you getting orange again for the next RS? Need to vary the coffee car color

Vic