Question for the DE guys who run Hoosiers?
02-27-2012, 01:31 PM
#31
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
For a GT3 used in DE (20 minutes sessions average, 1 Heat Cycle per session, no street driving):
R6: 16 HC
A6: 8HC
They look fresh after these many heat cycles, and plenty of tread left. If you use them beyond that, you're on your own. You start getting the on/off type of grip, it just take this ice grip at the wrong spot on a racetrack to get you and others in trouble.
If your alignment is on the spot, flipping tires on the wheels helps very little. I don't flip my Hoosiers.
I don't swap the tires from left/right and right/left to improve tread wear either. There is something really bad about having a tire rotating at 160mph in one direction, then forcing the tire to do the same on the other direction the next day, the sidewalls wear out quicker doing this.
I'm quite picky with tire management, as failures on them can be catastrophic. In more than 200 track days, I have had 2 tire incidents, a MPSC that wore out to the cords and exploded at WGI (my mistake for not checking tire wear), and a flat at Sebring on my RE-11 (a loose tire valve that was not fully bolted, now part of my tech procedure).
From the many things autocross teaches, an important one is tires management.
R6: 16 HC
A6: 8HC
They look fresh after these many heat cycles, and plenty of tread left. If you use them beyond that, you're on your own. You start getting the on/off type of grip, it just take this ice grip at the wrong spot on a racetrack to get you and others in trouble.
If your alignment is on the spot, flipping tires on the wheels helps very little. I don't flip my Hoosiers.
I don't swap the tires from left/right and right/left to improve tread wear either. There is something really bad about having a tire rotating at 160mph in one direction, then forcing the tire to do the same on the other direction the next day, the sidewalls wear out quicker doing this.
I'm quite picky with tire management, as failures on them can be catastrophic. In more than 200 track days, I have had 2 tire incidents, a MPSC that wore out to the cords and exploded at WGI (my mistake for not checking tire wear), and a flat at Sebring on my RE-11 (a loose tire valve that was not fully bolted, now part of my tech procedure).
From the many things autocross teaches, an important one is tires management.
02-27-2012, 01:33 PM
#32
Rennlist Member
m+s tires on a dry track with our crowd would get me run over... for $50 mounted I would do it though
02-27-2012, 01:38 PM
#33
Rennlist Member
I am committed
I do not street drive the car very much -- lucky to get it out on weekends once in a while.
In fact was going to go out yesterday as we had a rare flash of good weather and it appears I have a failing clutch switch.
02-27-2012, 01:40 PM
#34
Nordschleife Master
Rumor has it......from a good source
Toyo will be re introducing the RA1 compound in Porsche sizes, 4/32" out of the mold
If this is true, and the compound has the same wear......most will start running ths tire
Toyo will be re introducing the RA1 compound in Porsche sizes, 4/32" out of the mold
If this is true, and the compound has the same wear......most will start running ths tire
02-27-2012, 01:43 PM
#35
Rennlist Member
Yes. They will be producing RA1's pre-molded to shaved depth.
02-27-2012, 01:44 PM
#36
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Most people I see on slicks / Hoosiers dont belong on them anyways. I have been to many tracks and met many people (some on this forum), most could learn better car control by stepping into a lesser tire an dlearning to drive the limit at a slower pace.
You will know when you need Ho Ho / slicks to go faster, if you dont know you are not going fast enough on the tire you have. I cant tell you how many students I get that show up on sticker Hoosiers, most the time I convince them by the end of the weekend to switch to a more progressive slip tire.
For DE a Toyo RA1 type compound is the perfect compromise. The softer the tire higher the grip limit is, but they also snap quick.
What fun is a 2:16 or so at Sebring when you sit waiting for a point by by another GT3 doing 2:25's in the same group as you.
Its more fun chasing a GT3 on sticker slicks and passing him
You will know when you need Ho Ho / slicks to go faster, if you dont know you are not going fast enough on the tire you have. I cant tell you how many students I get that show up on sticker Hoosiers, most the time I convince them by the end of the weekend to switch to a more progressive slip tire.
For DE a Toyo RA1 type compound is the perfect compromise. The softer the tire higher the grip limit is, but they also snap quick.
What fun is a 2:16 or so at Sebring when you sit waiting for a point by by another GT3 doing 2:25's in the same group as you.
Its more fun chasing a GT3 on sticker slicks and passing him
RA1 is a great tire. If you can get your hands on them. So few options for a .1 narrow body in 18". I won't run the Kumho's any more after what happened with the ones I bought last month. So I'm stuck with R6's until Toyo re-releases the RA1's this summer so I want to make sure I'm getting the most out of them. Even if I could get some, it just doesn't give me the warm fuzzies running 6 year old tires.
Do any of you check your R6 tire temps after coming in from a session?
02-27-2012, 01:45 PM
#37
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
02-27-2012, 01:48 PM
#38
Nordschleife Master
02-27-2012, 02:03 PM
#41
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
I just started. I'm trying to take the tire thing more seriously. I bought a mid level longacre tire temp probe and a durometer. I'm going nuts, just trying to take a slightly more scientific approach.
I'm trying to pick a tire and set the car up around that particular tire. I'm not helping myself by switching tires brands all the time.
I found that I'm 40 degrees or so less than what hoosier recommends for optimal grip. Not sure what to do to bring those temps up. I believe my camber is set at -3 front and -2.5 rear
I'm trying to pick a tire and set the car up around that particular tire. I'm not helping myself by switching tires brands all the time.
I found that I'm 40 degrees or so less than what hoosier recommends for optimal grip. Not sure what to do to bring those temps up. I believe my camber is set at -3 front and -2.5 rear
02-27-2012, 02:07 PM
#42
Rennlist Member
I'm trying to pick a tire and set the car up around that particular tire. I'm not helping myself by switching tires brands all the time.
I found that I'm 40 degrees or so less than what hoosier recommends for optimal grip. Not sure what to do to bring those temps up.
I found that I'm 40 degrees or so less than what hoosier recommends for optimal grip. Not sure what to do to bring those temps up.
As for your second question: DRIVE FASTER. That's how to get temps up.
02-27-2012, 02:08 PM
#43
Three Wheelin'
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Had a nice chat with a race engineer @ 48 and we were discussing the tire temp issue. And while science does lie behind the test instruments the application and disection of data is clearly in the "art" camp as sooooo many variable can manipulate your findings. In short a large and continous sample is needed to spot trends. Congrats on the "game-on" your $pending has officially commenced
02-27-2012, 02:10 PM
#45
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
IMO take temps at all 4 corners, coming into the pits HOT, by having a friend there with your pyrometer. No need to do this every session, just once after each change you make to the car will give you a baseline.
As for your second question: DRIVE FASTER. That's how to get temps up.
As for your second question: DRIVE FASTER. That's how to get temps up.
