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I do some open track days in mine. About 715 wheel hp with the methanol system on,.. 625/630 with it off.
I run Ohlins R&T coil-overs. ($2,800 ish)
Overall very nice. Stable on track (Stock suspension was scaryon track,.. and even worse with a DSC module (though the DSC made it nicer on the street).
Only complaint might be that it could use a tad less compression dampening in front.
I am at 16-17 clicks from full stiff in front,.. and about 13 out in the rear.
This Winter I'll have a compression shim taken out of the fronts so I can have a bit more rebound and less comp up there. Probably ending up at 15 clicks out.
Stuff like Penske and Moton are very nice,. but their seals aren't meant for street use,.. and you end up rebuilding them every 10,000 miles. Great for race car,.. but a major hassle for a street car.
Otherwise I have;
GT3 front control arms with 10mm spacers. (11mm including headlight thing)
7mm rear wheel spacers and longer lug bolts
Tarrett rear toe links with optional locks
Porsche billet cup LSD
Still run stock sway-bars and end-links.
Thanks Duck! Given my engine is built, bored out to 3.8 and running enhanced GT2 turbos, I'm running a little over 700whp with just pump gas. I feel like my car is bouncing all over the place and unstable in the turns with stock suspension and DSC controller. I feel like I'm working pretty hard to keep it stable and have to really watch the power I'm putting down in the turns. I rarely can go full throttle until I feel the tires and balance of the car stabilize. You think the list of parts I'm getting should help?
I do some open track days in mine. About 715 wheel hp with the methanol system on,.. 625/630 with it off.
I run Ohlins R&T coil-overs. ($2,800 ish)
Overall very nice. Stable on track (Stock suspension was scaryon track,.. and even worse with a DSC module (though the DSC made it nicer on the street).
Only complaint might be that it could use a tad less compression dampening in front.
I am at 16-17 clicks from full stiff in front,.. and about 13 out in the rear.
This Winter I'll have a compression shim taken out of the fronts so I can have a bit more rebound and less comp up there. Probably ending up at 15 clicks out.
Stuff like Penske and Moton are very nice,. but their seals aren't meant for street use,.. and you end up rebuilding them every 10,000 miles. Great for race car,.. but a major hassle for a street car.
Otherwise I have;
GT3 front control arms with 10mm spacers. (11mm including headlight thing)
7mm rear wheel spacers and longer lug bolts
Tarrett rear toe links with optional locks
Porsche billet cup LSD
Still run stock sway-bars and end-links.
Where do you see Ohlins for 2800? I cannot find better than 3350... How many miles do you have with them? Have you modified the shim stacks at all yet, or will this be the first subtle adjustment you make? Also what makes you feel like its too much compression?
I feel like my car is bouncing all over the place and unstable in the turns with stock suspension and DSC controller. I feel like I'm working pretty hard to keep it stable and have to really watch the power I'm putting down in the turns. I rarely can go full throttle until I feel the tires and balance of the car stabilize. You think the list of parts I'm getting should help?
The guy that sold me my suspension is a suspension engineer and consultant. Has build championship winning NASCARS, lots of Sprint asphalt stuff,. and is head engineer of drive-train for the Hellcats, Trackhawk, Demon etc in his day job.
He has shock and spring dynos in his home shop, and tested my stock PASM shocks on his dyno before we decided to go aftermarket.
The stock shocks unplugged are in their stiffest setting. (Let's call it a 10) In that setting,.. they are super-critical for the spring . I.E. they are like 2 x as stiff as they should be for the spring.
With PASM,. the shocks are run at about a 3 out of 10 in normal. And in 8 of 10 when the button is lit. (This according to testing by DSC)
The DSC controller uses the entire range. 1- 10. And when you're hammering the car,.. it may have some of those shocks in the 10 setting.
What I would feel is when going fast over slightly rough cement,.. the front end would skitter over the pavement. VERY unsettling.
I think that was because the shocks were super-critical,.. and when you hit a crack in the pavement,.. the wheel would stay airborne for a bit. And the car would slide to the outside of the turn.
With the OHLINS,.. al of that was GONE. Gone daddy gone. Ride slightly firmer,.. but not at all uncomfortable (And I live in the Detroit area,.. so our roads are on the poor side)
Where do you see Ohlins for 2800? I cannot find better than 3350... How many miles do you have with them? Have you modified the shim stacks at all yet, or will this be the first subtle adjustment you make? Also what makes you feel like its too much compression?
Read above.
The guy not only dyno'd my stock shocks,.. but he is a dealer for Bilstein and Ohlins and others. He had the guys at Bilstein and Ohlins each pull shocks off the shelf,... dyno them,.. and send him the graphs. Then based on the graphs, he recommended the Ohlins.
Then after they arrived to his shop, he put each of the springs and each of the shocks on his dyno's and tested them to make sure they were what they should be,.. and that x-clicks out on one ft shock equaled x-clicks out on the other ft shock, etc. (With a lot of cheaper shocks,... 12 clicks out on one might equal 14 clicks out on the other.)
He also established baseline settings I should start out with for street and track. Such at 15 out for street,.. and 10 out for track (as a starting point).
Then he personally delivered them to my garage,.. and a few months later drove the car and made suggestions for changes. The front end was just riding up and down over bumps (not absorbing any of them),.. so we needed to go softer. The rear had some after wobble,.. so we needed to go a couple clicks firmer.
As of yet,.. I have not had them re-valved from stock. Waiting for the Winter months when the car will be off the road. (Even though it should only be a couple day turn-around.)
As for compression in front,... if I stiffen the front a bit (they're single-adjustables),.. the car goes up and down over bumps instead of the suspension absorbing them. And if I soften the fronts 2-3 clicks to get the front suspension to "work",... the front gets jiggley. (Technical term, ha, ha).
The consultant thought it may need a bit less compression (or more rebound) when he drove it. And after lots of miles,.. I agree (BUT,.. I'm no susp expert).
My understanding is that they are not offering them currently - but are fulfilling the recall - Hence why they aren't on the Ohlins site atm
Ive spoken to a few vendors from eBay (reputable) and they say they have them via email.... but I haven't purchased which is always the litmus test?
TPC Tractive for superior ride quality at any speed over any road condition. lighting fast damper response.
DSC module tuned for the greater dampening range over the stock B4's
TPC Tractive for superior ride quality at any speed over any road condition. lighting fast damper response.
DSC module tuned for the greater dampening range over the stock B4's
But at 3 x the price? Not chasing lap records here.......
would love to upgrade to b16, have it sit lower for better stance. unfortunately, my steep driveway pretty much limits my chin spoiler for stock height. any lower and grind city... even when taking angled entry/exit.
option would be to add on something like cargraphic front lift...it seems like a plausible solution, but have only come across one forum member here with experience on theirs, fairly positive if i recall.
still...a hefty price tag for a set-up that would require some some sort of front lift solution, for a casual driving car that would never see track time.
not sure if worth it, for my usage.
You're standing on the edge of the same cliff I was earlier this season. Tracking my 997TT regularly, moving up through the run groups quickly, and ready to go ***** deep on track prepping the turbo. Albeit not directly suspension related, in terms of cost you've got a few more things to add to your list: track wheels, track rubber, half cage, seats and harnesses. If you do all that suspension work, you're going to need all these things to properly take advantage of your big power and new found suspension capabilities. Looking at the thick end of $25k+ before your project is complete.
I opted to take that $ and just buy an already built dedicated track car. It's slow as ***** on the straight. But I lap over 5 seconds faster than my 997TT on a 1:32 lap. Most fun I've ever had with pants on.
But back to your question. Your suspension list looks good but I'd challenge you on the KW V3's for a few reasons:
- They are not serious track duty units (spring rates are very soft compared to other more 'track focused' coilovers ie AST, Moton, JRZ, MCS, etc...
- Are you planning to take advantage of 3-ways? Are you going to spend the hours and $$$ tuning rebound, high speed compression and low speed compression? IMO us weekend warriors will never take advantage of 3-ways, and you're better off spending the same $ on better built but less adjustable (1 way or 2 way) JRZ's, AST's or other proper track coilover
- Have you ever taken a ride in a car setup like the list you've put together? You will not achieve a good compromise; it will either be too soft for the track, or great at the track and abysmal on the street. This is the fundamental reason I went the track car route; ruining the ability to enjoy the 997TT on the street
- You're spending big bucks on adjustable components - if you're still going to be using the car on the street, are you actually going to take advantage of the camber settings (-3.0 or more up front) you're able to achieve with this hardware? Even with this hardware, you're going to be stuck at -2.3 to -2.5 if you're doing any amount of street driving - or else be cording the insides of the front tires every couple thousand miles. Most r-compounds and slicks need -3.0 or more for proper performance
The 997TT with your list of components but swapping the KW's for better units, would make an absolute beast at the track! I would love to experience that. But you have to be real with yourself - you will be seriously reducing your enjoyment of driving the car on the street. You know you're going to go to seats and harness bar too (all us track junkies do), so factor those in too.
The 997TT with DSC, a set of damptronic coilovers retaining PASM, rear GT2 sway, front LCA's, rear toe kit and track alignment (plus some properly sticky rubber) would be the ultimate street / track combo. With the power available, this setup would absolutely destroy GT3's and just about anything else at the track when properly driven. And without ruining the street manners of the car.
Edit: One more thing I meant to add - have you ever let a pro drive your car at the track while you ride shotgun? Sitting right seat while a pro manhandles your whip around the track doing things you didn't think were possible gives you new appreciation for the limits of your car's current capabilities - and helps you assess whether your current plateau is hardware related or simply the current limit of your personal skill set / comfort level. With some good coaching, you may be able to start demolishing those GT3's even without going hammy ham on the suspension hardware setup.
Thanks for this information, I will be doing my suspension in the winter, can we get the reasoning of why you are suggesting the front LCA and Rear toe kit?
Thanks for this information, I will be doing my suspension in the winter, can we get the reasoning of why you are suggesting the front LCA and Rear toe kit?
BTW what shop in Toronto works on your race cars?
I have Speed Star in Markham do a lot of the work for mine. They maintain and run the GT3 Cup Cars for Downtown Porsche.
The Tractive Coilovers may be the most expensive, but they are also the best. +1 for a Tractive w/ DSC when properly configured.
I've had Tractive/DSC on my Gt2 since 2016 and on the way into work today driving over our crappy repaired roads I was musing that a GT2 with solid links and bushings should not be this comfortable at low speeds and a few miles later be rock solid at three figure speeds, they really are an amazing product.
10-30-2018, 05:10 PM
so maybe we could get a group buy going?
