SUVp.cay

1) Will 19" winter tires be fine or should I really take a hit on looks/handling and go 18's?

2) Is the consensus that Pirelli Scorpion Winter is superior to the Pirelli Scorpion Ice &Snow? Please state why or why not. Also please comment on tire noise, dry road handling, and snowy weather grip.

3) Will run flat versions of these tires be nearly as good as the non-runflat versions...pertaining to ride quality, handling, pothole absorbtion etc...?

My thoughts are if I go 19" non-rfs, the sidewall will be a bit more forgiving in winter bad bumpy roads and may actually perform similarly to the same model tire but in a RF 18" version... Correct?

Thanks!

wrinkledpants

1. I think the majority choose 18" because of the tire selection. If you're talking the same tire between 18 and 19, and hypothetically the width of the tire is the same between 18 and 19, then they will perform roughly the same. Sidewall height only comes into play with offroading; it won't do much for you on ice or getting snow traction.

2. They're both performance snow tires, so neither will be as aggressive as a studies winter tire. Just by looking at the tread, the Ice and Snow would likely be a bit more aggressive and geared towards snow and ice traction. They'll probably be more squirmy on dry pavement. Snow grip is going to come down to the tread pattern of the tire. Ice grip is going to come down to the compounds in the tire. A snow tire that's better at ice is going to be really squirmy in the dry. There is no tire that will do it all. They're both from pirelli, they're both performance snows, I think they're going to be pretty dang close in performance between the two. You're looking for someone to provide you clear evidence that one is superior to the other, and you're not going to get it because they're both really close tires.

3. Run flats have stiff sidewalls, as you've eluded to. This won't impact your ability to grip ice, though. The sidewall stiffness on a run flat 18" tire is going to be pretty harsh. Much harder than a 19" tire.

SUVp.cay

Thanks for the reply. I see your points. I guess what my goal would be to get a tire right in between a high performance snow and an aggressive snow tire...that has fairly low tread noise and handles reasonably well on dry pavement. Not sure it exists.

In Southern New England we have our share of snow, but a good portion of the time the roads are treated well and are down to the pavement. Driving up to Vermont to ski can be a different story. I just don't want to be constantly reminded I have snow tires on with a spongy sidewall and excess tire noise.

wrinkledpants

What are the average temps in the winter? What's your day to day driving like (commute 10 miles on a straight interstate, mostly city, a mix of suburbs and city, etc)? Do you spend a lot of time on high speed twisties, or are the road speeds a bit slower? What kind of distances do drive to ski in vermont? Are those roads pretty twisty?

yeldogt

Not an exact comparison.

I bought a Porsche set for my 06 ... I guess it must have been the winter of 07. Porsche supplied 18" wheels and Dunlop Grandtrek's ... I really liked them ... enough that I use them on my Jaguar (second set) and my MB 4matic wagon. I had used Blizzak and Pirelli previously.

I found the Dunlops to be every bit as good as the Blizzak's in the snow and ice and much better on dry pavement. The Porsche is basically unstoppable with them in the snow. And they held up ... much better then the Blizzak.

Unless you are in extremely cold weather .. and all ice .. I think the performance snows are the way to go. I no longer have the 06 -- but the other two are around and even the Jaguar with RWD made it thorough this past winter.

SUVp.cay

Interesting....

I live in MA in the suburbs. I do a mix of city and rural driving. I do live in the snow belt inland in MA (so I am not near the coast). My commute is 12 minutes and mostly highway.

I do ski in the mountains of VT and NH which is a mix of highway (70% highway driving and 30% twisties). The mountains are between 2 and 3 hours away. If the roads are clear, the twisties are of moderate speed...and if snowy or post snowstorm then at much reduced speed.

Roads in MA can be clear to pavement or a wintery mess to heavy snow and ice. Temps can be -10 to 40 degrees with an occasional thaw into the 50s. Avg winter temp during the winter months of approx 28-30 degrees, but it can get very cold for weeks at a time. In VT and NH there is considerably more snow and its even colder.

In the regions I drive the avg yearly snowfall ranges between 67" south to 80"+ up north with 170" to 200" + in higher elevations. I do seem to be hovering at a tire to be a less aggressive dedicated snow to a more aggressive high performance snow tire.

Options I am kicking around (I am open to other suggestions) are: Dunlop Winter Sport 3d, Yokohama Iceguard ig51v, Pirelli Scorpion Winter or Scorpion Ice and Snow or the Nokian R2. The Michelin Latitude or X-Ice are big $ and not sure they are the right tire for me. Knowing the options I don't like excessive tire noise or overly sloppy handling. But these are dedicated winter wheels so I don't want to "under" do things either.

I was in a friends car with Blizzaks and the tread noise was unacceptably loud.

I take it that I should get normal tires and stay clear of the RF versions.

yeldogt

The Bilzzaks for years were one of only two really good snows IMO -- short of going with studs. They were always a bit squishy and I thought quiet the first year then a bit louder and less squishy as they aged. They got you where you needed to go and back.

With the advent of the new class of tires ... and the fact that the snow removal is so much better then years ago ... its quite amazing almost everywhere in the north east .... I just want to make sure that I can get out of where ever I am should it really come down. The more performance tires will do that.

I find that most of the time I'm still driving on dry pavement -- but I don't have to worry. When you are in snow country every parking lot is snow covered -- and my driveway.

I can't give you a recommendation from one winter sport tire to another .. I found the Dunlops to be a predictable and quiet .. and very durable. My Jaguar really eats rear tires -- so that is why I tried another set. And they have been very good.

Hammer911

I had 21" snows on my '09 Turbo s. They were great last winter here in colorado. That said, I just moved the Cayenne to Florida, so I have the unmounted tires with about 3k miles on them for sale if anybody can use them!

Eli355

How much are you looking for on he winter 21's

Hammer911

(About $350 each new...) 750 + shipping

SUVp.cay

What do you all think of this LM-80 Blizzak V rated high performance snow tire, which now comes in a non-run flat version this year?

http://www.blizzak.eu/en/lm80/features

leek

I am in Pacific NW but run in the Cascades and the Rockies during the winter. On my 08 CTT I have used stock 21" summer, !9" Pirelli Ice and Snow, Other brand all season tire (twice). The Pirelli I and S took me anywhere I wanted to go and I ran them for more miles than any of the others.

SUVp.cay

I keep hearing the Pirelli Ice & Snow come up, I am sure for a good reason. I am not seeing the Pirelli in a size 255/50/R19 come up in non-RF that has a good speed rating ie V or above. . Is this a Porsche spacific non-RF tire that I can only get at a Porsche dealer? What is the speed rating you all are running on the I & S non-RF?

wrinkledpants

The dunlop wintersport 3D is a great tire, and super popular with the Audi crowd out here in Denver. Probably the most popular choice for winter weather. It's also what I used to run on my old S4. It's quiet and has good dry weather performance, which is important out here given that it can be dumping in the mountains, and an hour later you're in Denver where it's sunny and 60 degrees. Looking at the LM-80, they appear to be a similar tread. The wintersport tire doesn't come in the more common sizes you see on a cayenne, but if you go up one size or pick a less common wheel size, you'll find them. I know they come in 275/45/20 in the required load rating for the cayenne. If I ran a 20" snow tire, I wouldn't hesitate to use this choice. If you're able to find it in a smaller wheel choice, and it meets the load rating, this might be a good choice for you since you're concerned about road noise and dry weather performance.

mudman2

i have run 9 seasons so far on 18 Scorpion Ice and Snow, about 3 seasons a set, I will stick with them since they work