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Ya know, i love this car, but its starting to be more of a headache than its worth.... and everything happens in the winter after i put my 3rd car into hibernation...
Anyhow... all had been fine since i replaced the water pump/ seal, about 3K miles since that and my last oil change... after a 1K mile trip out of town for the holidays, i got back to notice some oil on the garage floor the last couple of days... i went in there thinking i just didn't tighten the oil filter canister tight enough, and there's oil everywhere under the car, and it's definitely coming from the front of the engine. Doesnt appear to be coming from the valve covers, and from what i can tell, it looks like it's coming from the same area as where the water pump is located... see the attached photo - this was all cleaned up when the water pump was replaced, and now it's all gunked again and looks to me like it's where the oil leak is coming from... i had the pump and seal replaced by an indy shop, so i dont know whats back there... anything that would be the culprit? Any other ideas or photos i can take to help me diagnose?
This photo is from the font, right below the intake "Y", looking at the water pump pulley... also a zoomed in photo
Can't tell from the photos you've provided, but from the factory the 2011 CTT used a thermostat housing with glued in fittings - that like to come loose. Are you sure it's oil you're seeing? The deposits I see there sure look like coolant residue. In removing the water pump - the thermostat housing is right behind it, and maybe 15 additional minutes to replace (and about $300 for the new housing.) Too bad the independents didn't suggest this to you.
The fix is to replace it with Porsche's newer thermostat housing with bolted in fittings. If I had to guess, one of your fittings is coming loose, and it won't be long before the fitting will come loose and you lose all your coolant in a hurry.
There are some DIY articles in the DIY subforum about this, and a thread or two here that are quite detailed. You may want to print out and take the articles to your independent. If they blow them off - find a new independent.
I'm absolutely certain its oil - - the color is oil, it smells like oil and it feels like oil.. i can get some more photos to prove... i also might try and reach my hand in there where my photo is and try to get some of that gunk on a rag to check as well - - however, what's under the car is absolutely 100% oil
also, the thermostat and thermostat housing had already been replaced about 20K miles ago by the previous owner... when i had an issue with the water pump, the same thing came up, "when they changed the thermostat and housing, why didn't they replace the water pump and seal?".... i have no idea why, but what i can say with certainty is that all of that has been remedied.
The car is no longer losing any coolant, but it did use about a 1/4 quart of oil on my 1K mile trip.... of which is now all over the underbelly of the car... i've wiped a lot of it up, but i'm sure there's still some areas i can take pictures of...
Update!
i caught a glimmer of something this morning... there's oil sitting in the valley between the intake and the valve covers... ive attached several pics... i think it's pooling in here, then running over the front on the engine, resulting in why it looks like it's coming from the water pump area...
Any idea what this might be? From what i can tell, i dont see any wet areas around the valve cover, but there's a lot of crap going on in there so it's tough to tell.... are there any seals on the intake that could leak oil? From my knowledge of domestic cars id say no, but i often feel like my knowledge is worthless with this car ....
On the first pic, focus between the throttle body and the egr-valve looking thing...if i need to circle it i can, but I'm on my phone so I'l have to figure it out
3rd and 4th pics show the oil on both sides of the intake
last pic is my fancy tool to soak up some fluid and confirm it's oil
I had some oil leaking when I did my water pump and thermostat. Purchased new aluminum one time screws for the timing chain cover and the valve covers. Installed them and no leaks to date. These aluminnum bolts get fatigued and I think they may just loosen up a bit over time. Whatever your do,never ,never reuse an aluminum screw in to the engine block. They will break.
Keep us posted as this is an important topic. Will help as much as we can.
I had some oil leaking when I did my water pump and thermostat. Purchased new aluminum one time screws for the timing chain cover and the valve covers. Installed them and no leaks to date. These aluminnum bolts get fatigued and I think they may just loosen up a bit over time. Whatever your do,never ,never reuse an aluminum screw in to the engine block. They will break.
Keep us posted as this is an important topic. Will help as much as we can.
I was in the garage cleaning up oil when you replied... so since i already have it mostly apart, i decided to just remove the air/oil separator. It and all around it are completely dry, so i don't think its the culprit. I always followed the hoses that run to both sides from it and none of them seem to have any oil residue on them either... and i've looked all around the valve covers and i don't see anywhere that it seems like it could be spitting oil from..
I cleaned up as much of the oil in the little valleys on both sides between the intake manifold and the valve covers with hopes that if i drive it tonight a little bit, i can at least get an idea of where the oil is starting from.... i have no idea if it'll work, but its worth a shot.
Keep the ideas coming..... grr, this car is aggrivating
Your leak may be coming from the timing chain cover. The radiator fan could be blowing the oil up and into your valley pan area. I was looking at the cayenne engine, without the intake on, and the only place you can be leaking from is the air/oil separator hoses, the valve covers and/or the timing chain cover.
Oil on garage floor and front of engine tells me that it could very well be the timing chain cover.
Who did the water pump? They may have unscrewed one or a few of the timing cover bolts by mistake. Then in reinstaling them, they snapped them or just didn't get them torqued properly or didn't even tighten them back to where they were. Super easy for it to happen.
If this is the case, do not retighten them. Go buy new ones! If you need, I'll look in my bolts bin and see if I have a few I can mail out to you today.
RAudi - thanks so much for your help - - sorry to answer your question with another question, but what's the best way to assess this?? its awful tight down in there, i'm not real sure how i'll assess if that's it, unless i start tearing apart... should i remove the intake? go as far as removing the water pump pulley?
The water pump was replaced by an independent shop in downtown Rochester, NY. I could call and ask them, but i highly doubt they'd remember - i'll probably try to anyhow - doesn't hurt to ask.
Originally Posted by RAudi Driver
Your leak may be coming from the timing chain cover. The radiator fan could be blowing the oil up and into your valley pan area. I was looking at the cayenne engine, without the intake on, and the only place you can be leaking from is the air/oil separator hoses, the valve covers and/or the timing chain cover.
Oil on garage floor and front of engine tells me that it could very well be the timing chain cover.
Who did the water pump? They may have unscrewed one or a few of the timing cover bolts by mistake. Then in reinstaling them, they snapped them or just didn't get them torqued properly or didn't even tighten them back to where they were. Super easy for it to happen.
If this is the case, do not retighten them. Go buy new ones! If you need, I'll look in my bolts bin and see if I have a few I can mail out to you today.
I think you can get access to these bolts by just removing the y pipe and the serpentine belt. Maybe the water pump pully will have to come off to get a torx head socket in there. It's about 10 minutes of work to check that area.
I think you can get access to these bolts by just removing the y pipe and the serpentine belt. Maybe the water pump pully will have to come off to get a torx head socket in there. It's about 10 minutes of work to check that area.
I dug into it, but due to limited time i had to put it back together for the evening...
I was able to get a wrench on two of them - - with a 1/4" socket, and just some finger power, they snugged up a tad but really not much movement at all in them... I didn't want to screw anything up, so i didn't go trying to ensure they're bolstered down real tight...
I did call and talk to the mechanic that did the water pump - he said that the water pump job was real straight forward and he never touched any of the bolts related to the timing chain, nor did he touch anything that would be oil related... of course, take that for what it is...
I still left all the fancy plastic off... i'm out of time to tear into anything today, so i'll run the car a little tonight and see if i can get a better idea of where the oil is coming from...
If it's not obvious where the leak is coming from, first thing I would do is try to clean every trace of oil with soap and water. Low pressure wash top to bottom. Then go for a test drive.
Halfway through your test drive stop and check for fresh oil. Mechanics mirrors, dental mirrors and a flash light will help. Your oil looks dark so that is better than fresh oil when looking for the leak. I have even had to sprinkle baby power and look for the wet spot.
I know it's a lot of work... Clean, drive, clean, fix, clean again. But it's really the only way to pinpoint where the leak is.
It helps to leave all the non essential covers off during your test drive.
If it's not obvious where the leak is coming from, first thing I would do is try to clean every trace of oil with soap and water. Low pressure wash top to bottom. Then go for a test drive.
Halfway through your test drive stop and check for fresh oil. Mechanics mirrors, dental mirrors and a flash light will help. Your oil looks dark so that is better than fresh oil when looking for the leak. I have even had to sprinkle baby power and look for the wet spot.
I know it's a lot of work... Clean, drive, clean, fix, clean again. But it's really the only way to pinpoint where the leak is.
It helps to leave all the non essential covers off during your test drive.
I don't know that I have what i'd need to wash the engine bay, but i wiped up as much of the oil as i could, and took pictures of everything so that i have documentation of how it was.... drove it once day, and no oil has come to light... my wife drives it daily to work, so i'll be checking it each day and keep this forum updated.
I don't know that I have what i'd need to wash the engine bay, but i wiped up as much of the oil as i could
What about a coin operated car wash? The kind with the pressure water wand? Get a can of engine cleaner from your local auto zone, hose it down with the engine cleaner then pressure wash it off. That's what I used to do before I bought my own pressure washer. Lol, when I was a kid I would take my jack stands and jack with me and put the car in the air, pull the wheels off and pressure wash the whole drive train. Probably looked pretty funny now that I think about it.
12-30-2019, 08:54 PM
2011 CTT oil leak
