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I went back and looked at th video and sebs speeds under the bridge at the top of the hill and at the end of the apex curbjng at the bottom of the hill are almost identical in laps prior to the incident and the incident. I'm not a racer but that's the fact I find most surprising. I would have thought there would be more of a delta after a yellow flag.
SPB - Sprint 2: Recap - Was in 1st place with a large lead and with several laps to go - lost 3rd gear. Had to nurse it for the remaining race using 2nd and 4th gear. Wound up losing one position so finished 2nd in class. UGH!!
SPB - Enduro (after Restart): Recap - Gladwill had a perfect pit strategy putting him ahead after he came out of the pits as we were battling most of the race. 45 mins of yellows/on track black flag and a resorting of cars by the race officials had us doing a restart with very few laps remaining. Here's the final laps of the race.
This part here is exactly why many of us think there should have been a double yellow. It is the perfect scenario to take the judgement out of the racers hands for their safety. There were several near misses before the car that hit the yellow car, including one driver that drove on the grass between the yellow car and the wall. As I said, when I went by there was a stationary yellow and a debris flag - that does not indicate a car in the middle of the track. I did back down some, especially as I was being told to stay right on the radio, but I was still surprised to see a car in the track based on the flags.
Also, if you are one of the ones that think the track did a fine job of signaling on this incident, answer this question - next time will they do the exact same or immediately go to double yellow or black all? I can already answer this question as I was there for the enduros on Sunday and the they made much different calls on the incidents in those races.
I will chime in with the following...
I wasn't on track, but standing in the first grandstand past start/finish for the entire episode. Maybe 100 yards. Many of us witnessing the event were shocked that nothing more drastic was done to protect the stationary yellow car, AND alert the drivers on track regarding the situation. Having driven at Road America, and experienced their safety team in action, I believe they would have reacted much quicker than what I witnessed on Saturday. Many raise the question of whom at the track makes the call to deploy the safety team. PCA? Road Atlanta track officials? I am not sure of the protocol, but it needed to be done with a higher sense of urgency IMO.
I dont want to defend myself but I didn't slow down and the video shows it. Im glad i didnt hit the fellow racer by doing a last minute steering correction.
I had harold glued to my ***, in 10a-b
I wasnt paying enough attention to that yellow flag and was more in my rear view mirror and looking at the downhill 12.
I think in the case like that, a black or red flag would of more open up all eyes on racers. Still, i got passed by gmg cup and gtb3 car on 2x black flag stations during pratices....
My crew didnt call me the accident.
From talking to other racers and crews, they're are bunch of racers who didnt slow down, not just 3-4 of us. So, yes, we should all learn from that.
Green flag in station 1 , we re already full throttle after the yellow car incident.
I was in the race and was far enough behind Doug that he was getting out of his car when I went by. When I went under the bridge, it was a slow waving yellow (according to my video. I would have sworn on a Bible, it was a standing yellow) and debris flag. Since when is a car blocking the track for an extended period of time only a slow waving yellow? Especially in a blind downhill, high speed turn?
To add to the situation, there was a standing yellow in 10A. I looked and saw nothing around. Not sure why that was there and it caused me to wonder what was going on as I crossed under the bridge. I lifted and went down the hill expecting to see oil or a car part on the track, not to see the carnage I saw. If I was the guy in the yellow car, I would have been pissed it was not black flagged while I am sitting stalled ON THE TRACK in Turn 12 at Road Atlanta...Especially after car(s) have gone into the grass near the wall to avoid me. My two cents.
Short clip in slow motion. My question is whether the yellow is partially waving behind the debris flag. Better resolution would certainly help.
Wow, that was scary!!! However,.............yellow flag is a hint that someone might sitting on the racing line! you could have killed that guy! (and yourself) but glad it turned out ok! It wasnt even a pro race. when club racing , safety, not the battle should still be first on eveyones mind. after all, you are racing for a 5 dollar trophy with 10s of thousands invested in your ride. No excuse to "not see" a waving yellow flag .
I feel really badly for Clarke. His view of the flagger was obscured by the two cars ahead and even his view past the apex of T12 was blocked by those cars. If the yellow at the bridge was waving it was hard to tell with the standing debris flag (WTF??). In a tight gaggle of cars I can see how anyone could misread or miss that weird flag combo.
With his view repeatedly blocked by the cars ahead, that was some heads up driving by Clarke and he deserves some snaps.
Instead of insulting each other, we would do better to think of how to make things safer. A flagger on the backside of the bridge is not ideal, but I wouldn't expect any sane flagger to stand in front of the bridge so its a compromise.
And so, a flagger down below on the inside of T12 seems called for.
Seb shared his video in full and open disclosure and was forthcoming in explaining what he was thinking as it went down - even if it was ultimately an incorrect judgement. He's man enough to tell it like it is, no one is piling on. Hell of a driver too.
The flagging discussion is interesting, but a separate issue altogether.
I see this as a real learning opportunity and a great example of how important the basic protocols are. 9 times out of 10 you may get lucky, but once in a while, you won't. I think I speak for many here in that this is (strongly) reinforcing what we know, and being grateful we can all learn from a near miss and not a tragedy.
Yellow, whether waving or not you lift and figure out what is going on, period. That's rookie DE. Crew didn't call it in? Too bad, are they in the car with you, they have control of the wheel and throttle pedal? Jesus Christ, anyone with that attitude should be removed from club racing, this is sick.
I don't believe anyone answered Seth's question as to who makes the call on a FCY, black or red? I do believe it is the PCA steward but can someone confirm? Also, can race control see that corner (never been to that track)?
Yellow, whether waving or not you lift and figure out what is going on, period. That's rookie DE. Crew didn't call it in? Too bad, are they in the car with you, they have control of the wheel and throttle pedal? Jesus Christ, anyone with that attitude should be removed from club racing, this is sick.
I don't believe anyone answered Seth's question as to who makes the call on a FCY, black or red? I do believe it is the PCA steward but can someone confirm? Also, can race control see that corner (never been to that track)?
Race control makes that call after consultation with the PCA Chief Steward, standing or sitting next to them in the Tower.
Yes, this incident location is the closest part of the track to the Tower and fully visible from Race Control a few stories up.
__________________ -Peter Krause www.peterkrause.net www.gofasternow.com
"Combining the Art and Science of Driving Fast!"
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Everyone keeps talking about the yellow under the bridge... it was waving, it was stationary, yada, yada, yada.
Did anyone see the first standing yellow at the end of the back straight? Seem like everyone ignored that one too and went charging over the top of the blind hill.
IMHO, the yellow at the end of the back straight would have caught my attention.... since nothing was visible in the 10A/10B complex, I would have assumed a car off over the hill.
Also everyone keeps complaining the hill flagger wasn't waving fast enough. I doubt he could see exact location of the the accident car.
I'm overly cautious and slow under waving yellow. Been passed under waving yellow. Ok with me. If I hit/hurt anyone under a yellow I'd be disgusted with myself.
04-10-2018, 12:07 PM
you could have killed that guy! (and yourself) but glad it turned out ok! It wasnt even a pro race. when club racing , safety, not the battle should still be first on eveyones mind. after all, you are racing for a 5 dollar trophy with 10s of thousands invested in your ride. No excuse to "not see" a waving yellow flag .
