Howard

I think the track layout at WSIR is great, don't change it. What the facility needs are restrooms, some electrical outlets in the paddock area, a decent hotel less than 20 miles away, a fuel station that accepts credit cards, decent food, more asphalt than dirt in the paddocks, and last but not least...how about some shade for the grandstands when it's a gagillion degrees from April thru October...
Turn 8 is a blast, sixth gear, on the floor......but to get it right you have to scream from the turn-in of 8 all the way thru 9 ......it's a 10 on the sphincter scale...

macfly

Another thing. Does anybody not notice the development around the track?
That is one of the things I've really noticed over the last three years, the surround housing growth has really clicked up a gear or two.

Martin, you are missing the point a bit here, I am not saying change it, I am simply wondering HOW would you change it IF you'd like to, as some folks do. Any change I personally would suggest would not destroy what is there, it would simply add another dimension to it, that's all!

I'm very happy that Chris Cervilli is happy with it just the way it is. He obviously has nothing to offer in that respect because he loves it the way it is, thus the question doesn't apply to him.

I can't beliieve this subject has got so many folks all up in arms, this is just a hypothecical question to see how those who WOULD like to make some changes might propose doing so. That's all!!

Martin S.

I would not change Willow Springs...so I will disappear from this thread.

SundayDriver

Well you asked for thoughts as well as ideas so here goes...

I would not change it because, IMO, it would destroy the character of the track. Each great track has a personality and WSIR's personality is that of a high speed, momentum track. At Willow, HP will not make up for mistakes or lack of talent. It is an incredibly difficult track to go really fast on (and I suck there). Adding a twisty, technical section would completely change the nature of the beast - kind of like suggesting that we should colorize Ansel Adams' photos.

In a low powered car, like the SRF that I have driven there, the section from the exit of 5 to 9 entry is boring but there is still a challenge to keep all the speed you can get. Even in such a car, the rest of the track is a major test of nerve. Add some HP and there are few cars that are not exciting over 6 and through T8. I suspect a GT-3 could get to 135-140 there - my level of talent would certianly not be bored doing that - maybe you are so good it is not a challenge. Try T8 in a high HP TT on street tires when you enter at ~150 and there is no way you can carry all that speed on the pavement. Or a wings 'n things where you trim out all the downforce and try to hang on for dear life at speeds approaching 150 through there and try to take T9 FLAT.

Mike in Chi

" completely change the nature of the beast - kind of like suggesting that we should colorize Ansel Adams' photos."

Now there is a meaningful analogy.

I have a very cheap, but still stunning, repro of AA's 'Snake River Overlook" by my desk. Colorizing it would destroy the drama in it.

I wonder what Ansel Adams would have thought of photoshop?

Greg Fishman

Chris,
Is turn 8 faster than the Kink at Road America? Faster than 12 at Road Atlanta? If it is, it sure has my attention because that is flying.

JackOlsen

I don't think there's anything wrong with asking hypothetical questions. It gives the guys who find Willow boring a chance to speculate on what would liven it up for them. For the rest of us, it gives us a chance to think about what we like about the track, to me.

If tracks were drinks, Willow would be a shot of whisky, neat. Most of the more recently designed (and insurance-friendly) tracks are more like a Pina Colada.

For me, WSIR is the kind of track I imagined racing would involve when I was a kid.

It's very, very fast.

Here's a video clip of turn 8 on street tires, with the mistake being made of re-mounting the rear wheels and tires on the incorrect sides, and the driver having a brief lapse of concentration. (5.4 megs, Quicktime)

Here's a boring lap of 1:30.27, where I still get turns 1,2, 3 and 4 wrong. (7 megs, Quicktime)

Mike in Chi

Chris
I'd love to hear your answer to Greg's question as well. We had a thread last spring about the fastest tracks in North America. A lot of mentions of that turn.

Jack

Is that a lipstick camera? Great perspective you rarely see. Thnaks for posting it.

NetManiac

Actually, I think the owner of WSIR received "Historic" status recently. At least I remember seeing the "Historic Site" sign on my way out there a couple weeks ago. Which, if I understand California Law correctly, means it will remain an open exhaust race track for ever and ever amen. No matter what the developers in the area do.

Good thing the owner had some foresight to get jump through all those hoops now rather than wait until it became a big political mess.

NetManiac

What's a "WFO"?

Premier Motorsp

8 is WAY faster than those turns Greg mentions. 140-150 in any powerful car. 130 or so in a C car. The C car would be flat out.

However, I would say that the Kink and Road Atlanta's Turn 12 are bigger challenges. Much more dangerous etc.

It is a good track for sure. It is not Road America or Watkins Glen caliber, but much better than Lime Rock or Gingerman. One great thing about it is you can RACE, side-by-side all the way around. It is also pretty safe, good run off in most places. I have spun in 8 3 or 4 times and never damaged the car.

Chris Cervelli
Premier Motorsports

NetManiac

And finally... I would have to agree with M758 (and now Chris C.) driving it is one thing, but racing on it, it becomes a whole new animal. At least to me it did.

JackOlsen

Yes. It's the POV that a bug would have if it could hold onto the leading edge of the wing.

Mike in Chi

Mike

IIRC

W= wide

O = open

I have no F ing idea what F is

Robert Henriksen

Good point about evaluating tracks on different criteria - driving vs racing. My home track has three different configurations for SCCA races; one is vastly superior to the other two for tons of side-by-side (and six wide at times) racing.