View Poll Results: Which is more fun?
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Which would be more fun? GT3 or Boxster?
11-02-2010, 03:34 PM
#31
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I love this thread and so many of the responses are soooo right. I used to own a 997 GT3 and once I purchased a dedicated RSA track car (because I couldn't "afford to leave the Gt3 at the track"), the GT3 saw very little use and I sold it. Interesting to see that many others went the same way. Get a track only car and add every safety device available.
11-02-2010, 03:56 PM
#32
Mr. Excitement
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I think you learn More in a faster car than a slower one. Yes, more in the long run. All you need to drive a slow car is there in a fast one along with the added level of higher speeds and shorter reaction times. All cars are momentum cars.
There is 100% truth to the throw away car aspect to track driving. You will push harder, feel for and learn the edge better in a car you know in your heart you can walk away from and not look back...too much.
I went from a best of a single 1:31 (summit point) to some 1:20s in a row with more to go. Other than areo aspects I found that everything is for the most part the same just a bit faster. I would suspect that going from fast to slow would be frustrating to some extent unless there were more cars to play with in the move. I think that is the real key to on track fun, other close in speed cars and drivers to race or run with.
Any car can be made safer. A slow one with min safety gear might not be as safe as a faster one with fully planed out and built drivers safety compartment.
There is 100% truth to the throw away car aspect to track driving. You will push harder, feel for and learn the edge better in a car you know in your heart you can walk away from and not look back...too much.
I went from a best of a single 1:31 (summit point) to some 1:20s in a row with more to go. Other than areo aspects I found that everything is for the most part the same just a bit faster. I would suspect that going from fast to slow would be frustrating to some extent unless there were more cars to play with in the move. I think that is the real key to on track fun, other close in speed cars and drivers to race or run with.
Any car can be made safer. A slow one with min safety gear might not be as safe as a faster one with fully planed out and built drivers safety compartment.
11-02-2010, 04:33 PM
#33
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I think you learn More in a faster car than a slower one. Yes, more in the long run. All you need to drive a slow car is there in a fast one along with the added level of higher speeds and shorter reaction times. All cars are momentum cars.
There is 100% truth to the throw away car aspect to track driving. You will push harder, feel for and learn the edge better in a car you know in your heart you can walk away from and not look back...too much.
I went from a best of a single 1:31 (summit point) to some 1:20s in a row with more to go. Other than areo aspects I found that everything is for the most part the same just a bit faster. I would suspect that going from fast to slow would be frustrating to some extent unless there were more cars to play with in the move. I think that is the real key to on track fun, other close in speed cars and drivers to race or run with.
Any car can be made safer. A slow one with min safety gear might not be as safe as a faster one with fully planed out and built drivers safety compartment.
There is 100% truth to the throw away car aspect to track driving. You will push harder, feel for and learn the edge better in a car you know in your heart you can walk away from and not look back...too much.
I went from a best of a single 1:31 (summit point) to some 1:20s in a row with more to go. Other than areo aspects I found that everything is for the most part the same just a bit faster. I would suspect that going from fast to slow would be frustrating to some extent unless there were more cars to play with in the move. I think that is the real key to on track fun, other close in speed cars and drivers to race or run with.
Any car can be made safer. A slow one with min safety gear might not be as safe as a faster one with fully planed out and built drivers safety compartment.
11-02-2010, 04:51 PM
#34
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I first raced shifter karts ("go-karts") back in the day, and they still are a great deal of fun, although you can really get hurt at high speed.
It depends on your skill level - sounds like a less expensive race car might be the answer for now. I tend to drone on and on about the need to race a number of different cars - especially formula cars (the engine is in the back).
However, there are genetic determinants of skill, not just a sum of the number of track days.
It depends on your skill level - sounds like a less expensive race car might be the answer for now. I tend to drone on and on about the need to race a number of different cars - especially formula cars (the engine is in the back).
However, there are genetic determinants of skill, not just a sum of the number of track days.
11-02-2010, 04:58 PM
#35
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This thread is really interesting! I bought a 2010 GT3 about a year and a half ago. If you would have told me then that I needed a slower and less expensive (and less sentimental) car to drive on track to improve, I would have called it a crazy idea! All I can say is that driving my new to me Spec Miata has been a fantastic experience for improving my driving.
11-02-2010, 05:17 PM
#36
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Thanks for all the responses. There are some great points being made which has given me much to think about. At least I've got a long winter to do so.
I'll probably end up selling the GT3 in favor of a track only car. Which it will be? I don't know yet.
Anyone looking for a White '07 GT3? 7800 miles. Let me know.
Thanks again.
I'll probably end up selling the GT3 in favor of a track only car. Which it will be? I don't know yet.
Anyone looking for a White '07 GT3? 7800 miles. Let me know.
Thanks again.
11-02-2010, 05:20 PM
#37
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Winter?
WTF???
While you ladies are hunkered down dealing with 6 months of snow & ice, we're driving down here, yo!
Professional Racing and Driving Coach
WTF???
While you ladies are hunkered down dealing with 6 months of snow & ice, we're driving down here, yo!
Professional Racing and Driving Coach
11-02-2010, 05:36 PM
#38
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I'm not quite sure how to take your original comment, btw. Sounds like your taking a swipe at both options.
11-02-2010, 05:40 PM
#39
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Actually, I was not taking a swipe at either, since they are both excellent choices, and anyone having those choices would be fortunate indeed. Rather, I was sarcastically pointing out that the Boxster was a better choice for driving flat out hunting apexes, whereas the GT3 was a bettter choice for hunting...uh....other things.
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11-02-2010, 05:45 PM
#41
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Actually, I was not taking a swipe at either, since they are both excellent choices, and anyone having those choices would be fortunate indeed. Rather, I was sarcastically pointing out that the Boxster was a better choice for driving flat out hunting apexes, whereas the GT3 was a bettter choice for hunting...uh....other things.
Thanks.
11-02-2010, 05:54 PM
#42
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11-02-2010, 05:56 PM
#43
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11-02-2010, 06:04 PM
#44
Race Director
Five points:
1. Age: My current toy is an '89 944S2. 200hp at the crank, 20 years ago. And 20 years ago, everything was new and didn't need replacing. This year, I spent nearly $4000.00 on maintenance -- some unexpected (snapped my aftermarket A-arms at Monticello last month, coolant hose sprung a leak at Lime Rock) and some expected (new rotors). Total planned track days: 4. Total track days attended: 3.5. This isn't the first year that I've spent a lot of $$ on maintaining my car. A mechanic at my shop wisely pointed out to me, "Zoltan, if you want to track a 20 year old car, you need to be your own mechanic." I am not my own mechanic.
Lesson: the older the car, the more it will cost to track. An older Boxster may cost less initially, but the wear and tear costs will creep up on you sooner.
2. Reliability: GT3 - dry sump lubrication, beefier suspension. Boxster: RMS, IMS issues, no dry sump. GT3 wins hands down in terms of reliability. Maybe I'm biased, given that if I missed a sacrafic to the track gods on a given weekend, I'd just have to wait and see what's next to fail on my '44.
Lesson: No matter how much a high hp car will mask your mistakes, you will learn more in a GT3 that's running strong vs. a Boxster that's sidelined due to RMS issues.
3. Trackability: GT3 - all it needs is an alignment, and it can play on the track all day long. Motons, PSS10's..etc are all good upgrades, but essentially not necessary. Boxster: Motons, PSS9's, JBZ - take your pick. But you need to upgrade the suspension to get that car to go flatout. (Er - I mean to corner flat.)
Lesson: If you can use the proper tool for the task, why substitute it with something else?
4. Safety: canvas vs. fixed roof. Sorry, but I prefer to have sheet metal over my head, especially if the shiny side is down. If you open up the choices and include a Cayman, then this point is moot. (But the other points aren't).
Lesson: don't underestimate safety on a car that frequently will travel over 120mph.
5. Cost: you already own the GT3, or are paying it down. But theoretically, a Boxster is dirt cheap these days. Unless you want to upgrade the suspension, or if you need to rebuild the motor due to RMS issues. Or if the wear and tear items start going.
Lesson: "Pay me now, pay me later."
GT3 is a track car toned down to be drivable on the street. Boxster is a nice sports car that can be beefed up for the track. IMHO, a GT3 is better suited for the track. Then again, my view has been tainted by years of hunting down nagging problems with an older car.
That said - if you are seeking a low hp car - I can offer you my 944S2 - even swap for your GT3. That way, we'd both be happy!
-Z-man.
1. Age: My current toy is an '89 944S2. 200hp at the crank, 20 years ago. And 20 years ago, everything was new and didn't need replacing. This year, I spent nearly $4000.00 on maintenance -- some unexpected (snapped my aftermarket A-arms at Monticello last month, coolant hose sprung a leak at Lime Rock) and some expected (new rotors). Total planned track days: 4. Total track days attended: 3.5. This isn't the first year that I've spent a lot of $$ on maintaining my car. A mechanic at my shop wisely pointed out to me, "Zoltan, if you want to track a 20 year old car, you need to be your own mechanic." I am not my own mechanic.
Lesson: the older the car, the more it will cost to track. An older Boxster may cost less initially, but the wear and tear costs will creep up on you sooner.
2. Reliability: GT3 - dry sump lubrication, beefier suspension. Boxster: RMS, IMS issues, no dry sump. GT3 wins hands down in terms of reliability. Maybe I'm biased, given that if I missed a sacrafic to the track gods on a given weekend, I'd just have to wait and see what's next to fail on my '44.
Lesson: No matter how much a high hp car will mask your mistakes, you will learn more in a GT3 that's running strong vs. a Boxster that's sidelined due to RMS issues.
3. Trackability: GT3 - all it needs is an alignment, and it can play on the track all day long. Motons, PSS10's..etc are all good upgrades, but essentially not necessary. Boxster: Motons, PSS9's, JBZ - take your pick. But you need to upgrade the suspension to get that car to go flatout. (Er - I mean to corner flat.)
Lesson: If you can use the proper tool for the task, why substitute it with something else?
4. Safety: canvas vs. fixed roof. Sorry, but I prefer to have sheet metal over my head, especially if the shiny side is down. If you open up the choices and include a Cayman, then this point is moot. (But the other points aren't).
Lesson: don't underestimate safety on a car that frequently will travel over 120mph.
5. Cost: you already own the GT3, or are paying it down. But theoretically, a Boxster is dirt cheap these days. Unless you want to upgrade the suspension, or if you need to rebuild the motor due to RMS issues. Or if the wear and tear items start going.
Lesson: "Pay me now, pay me later."
GT3 is a track car toned down to be drivable on the street. Boxster is a nice sports car that can be beefed up for the track. IMHO, a GT3 is better suited for the track. Then again, my view has been tainted by years of hunting down nagging problems with an older car.
That said - if you are seeking a low hp car - I can offer you my 944S2 - even swap for your GT3. That way, we'd both be happy!
-Z-man.