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No sympathy to be found here. On the wrong scale I think invading a sovereign country and trying to bomb its citizens into submission ranks a little bit higher than confiscating a plane.
USA did the same thing to Iraq, and many other countries for example. There are many other conflicts in the world as well. Yet, we are focusing on Russia. For sure what Russia is doing is wrong. But the level of sanctions defies logic in my opinion.
USA did the same thing to Iraq, and many other countries for example. There are many other conflicts in the world as well. Yet, we are focusing on Russia. For sure what Russia is doing is wrong. But the level of sanctions defies logic in my opinion.
Perfect example of 'whataboutism' right here... While you worry about a large hunk of aluminum - that pregnant woman and her baby died after her maternity ward was hit by Russian rockets. But someone think of the Big Mac's they can't eat... /s
Perfect example of 'whataboutism' right here... While you worry about a large hunk of aluminum - that pregnant woman and her baby died after her maternity ward was hit by Russian rockets. But someone think of the Big Mac's they can't eat... /s
Not defending Russian aggression in Ukraine. I am saying these sanctions are not helping anyone. What if this hunk of aluminum was going to deliver medications next? And people who aren’t getting it are going to suffer or die?
Iraq and Ukraine are both war crimes. One main difference, tho is that western journalists are able to report uncensored from Ukraine.
Near the start of the Iraq war, I was watching DW (Deutche Welle)news. In one clip, American soldiers were marching young children out of their homes with their hands up at gun point. Only saw it once. I'm sure DW got their marching orders after that was seen
Not defending Russian aggression in Ukraine. I am saying these sanctions are not helping anyone. What if this hunk of aluminum was going to deliver medications next? And people who aren’t getting it are going to suffer or die?
1. There are transports all over available from non terrorist states. 2. It was delivering rapid tests. 3. The sanctions ARE helping. They showing the people that allow Putin to stay in power - that there is a cost to their support. Would you support an ICBM response or the carrot response? I'm sure the world would choose carrots. To do nothing as I think you are suggesting results in just giving a victory to Putin and allows him to set his sights on his other former Soviet States - now all now democratically elected. He even threatened Sweden and Finland with invasion if they joined NATO. HE MUST BE STOPPED. Short of war - what are your suggestions? Because as I see it, with heavy censorship in Russian media and online restrictions, sanctions that materially affect the avg citizen lead them to question why Putin is killing their cousins in the Ukraine and why he is allowing the economy to tank. This was all sold to them as freeing up a friendly State from bogus **** leaders. Now they see that most the world is penalizing their country *because* of Putin. Taking away cell phones from his troops so they can't call home or look at the web for the real truth won't work in the long term when they have lost 1/3 of the troops in 3 weeks that that took 4 years in their war in Afghanistan to achieve. Families will see this when the bags come home and I'm sure a General or two might take action. Already Russian tourists stuck in Thailand and around the world are calling home after watching international TV coverage...
“The thing is that when you think it’s your mission to make him [Putin] admit a lie, or an inconsistency in his previous statements [because he tends to make U-turns in his statements on policies], when you try to point out those inconsistencies or catch him red-handed lying, there’s no point because he’ll evade your question, he knows that he can just drown you in meaningless factoids or false moral equivalencies or by using what is called ‘whataboutism.’”
Whataboutism, Kovalev explains, is an old Soviet trick. If Putin is pressed by a Russian journalist about an allegation of serious human rights abuse in Russia, he’s very unlikely to directly address the question. Instead Putin might deflect or undermine the seriousness of the question by asking, Don’t human rights abuses happen in other countries as well? What about Guantanamo Bay'? -Alexey Kovalev, (formerly Moscow Times)
Torontoworker, I get it whataboutism is your favourite term. But show me when sanctions ever achieved anything? There were sanctions after Crimea annexation. What did that achieve? Iran has been under sanctions for 10 years, any progress there?
What sanctions do is make people angry at the counties imposing them. The people who don’t want to live under sanctions become immigrants or refugees which the western countries then have to accommodate.
Putin is a dictator and a despot, sanctions wont sway him. If we can’t go to warn against him, we should negotiate and make concessions. Such as not allowing Ukraine into Nato. I don’t see why the world would be less safe if Ukraine wasn’t a Nato member. However the world is definitely less safe when Putin is angry and threatening a global conflict. How much longer this will be a regional conflict with the west sticking to its position, sending weapons, maybe fighter jets soon?
Whataboutism, Kovalev explains, is an old Soviet trick. If Putin is pressed by a Russian journalist about an allegation of serious human rights abuse in Russia, he’s very unlikely to directly address the question. Instead Putin might deflect or undermine the seriousness of the question by asking, Don’t human rights abuses happen in other countries as well? What about Guantanamo Bay'? -Alexey Kovalev, (formerly Moscow Times)
I just wanted to share an airplane with people who might enjoy looking at such things.
We saw this coming out of YYZ a few days ago. My wife pointed it out, and I had no idea what it was. It was giant! Kind of cool to come to this forum and get an answer.
There's a surprising amount of plane-content here (which I love). Unfortunately, no thread can get to page 3 without turning into politics. C'est la vie.
03-14-2022, 04:24 PM
