Ronan

THE WIDE VARIETY OF OPINIONS ON THE 991 - SUMMARY

Are you as confused as I am?....I have now read a fair amount, heard a fair amount, (but not yet driven) the 991. I took a few minutes to extract some comments from the myriad reviews. There have been many journalists who have behind the wheel, and is seems to me that the difference is that the car is objectively better in every way, but in achieving it, it has lost something of its subjective Porscheness. I have the same feeling about the way BMW is taking the M cars. Here is a selection from both sides of the Atlantic. Most of the reviews are readily available in their entirety on line.

CONCLUSIONS:

Daily Telegraph:
"But is it a better 911? Here the 911 zoo begins a debate on just how scary a 911 should be. I think the 997 predecessor was marginally more of a Porsche."

Automobile Magazine:
"If the 991 is the only 911 you've ever driven, you'll probably think it's the best Porsche ever -- and in many ways we agree. If, on the other hand, you reveled in the old 911's endless feedback; if you relished the thrill of taming a car that didn't really want to be tamed; if you loved the 911 precisely because it wasn't perfect; and, certainly, if you thought that the Porsche 911 was an icon that couldn't be improved and shouldn't be changed, then the 2012 Porsche 911 might not feel like that much of an icon to you."

Car and Driver:
"Meanwhile, the new Carrera is more comfortable and transits quickly, more securely, and with less of the white-knuckle body heaving and tail twitching that has long defined the 911’s unique character. Porschephiles may have been wondering at what point their beloved 911 ceases to be a 911 and becomes just a good sports car with an engine in the trunk. That day may have arrived."

CAR:
" Its more refined.more comfortable.and more economical than ever before,but what matters is that it still has that unique 911 feel and character. The outgoing Carrera GTS is more interactive and involving but this new Porsche 911 isn't far behind - while offering a much broader range of talents to a larger audience."

MSN UK:
"It's impossible not to be impressed by what Porsche has achieved with its latest icon. Engineering and technology have been combined to push the boundaries of rear-engined design several steps forward.But it's not a five star car. By building a Porsche for a broader audience of buyers, a few too many of the little things that form an indelible part of the 911 appeal to enthusiasts have been pushed away."

Classic Car (John Simister)
"Objectively the new 911 is outstanding, but part of a 911's appeal has always been its streak of demanding imperfection. That's why I'd sooner snap up an almost-new 997 GTS while I still can. I never thought I'd consider a simple handbrake lever a bringer of joy, but I do now."

Wall Street Journal (Dan Neil)
' If anything, Porsche has managed to dial up the immediacy of the 911, with quicker reflexes—the electrical steering is first-rate—a more emotional exhaust note and, at full throttle, the capacity for real, edgy violence. You need only drop the Porsche into second gear and nail the throttle."

"The naturally aspirated, direct-injection 3.8-liter flat six mutters quietly, awaiting its chance. The suspension compliance is velvety, the throttle response relaxed. Porsche's product planners would like the new 911 to appeal to more women. Just call me Nancy.

This car is a work in progress? More like an unfinished masterpiece."



EVO ( quoted from a post here)

'Theres a layer of gauze between you and the car'
'Rather aloof and cold'
'Lacking cohesion and sweet uniformity of weights'
'An inconsistency of connection'
'A general lack of detail through the wheel'
'Sounds like..looks like...but doesnt drive like a 911'


Motor Sport:

"What astounds me is that this is just the start. In time will come the Turbos, GT3s and, lordy me, even GT2 variants – each faster and more ferocious. But if you believe in starting as you mean to go on, it’s hard to see how Porsche could have done a much better job of replacing its icon than this."


Autocar:

"I can’t honestly think of a new driver’s car due out in 2012 that’s likely t"o be better. A Lotus Evora may be a purer, more sweetly balanced thrill, but it lacks complexity next to the 911. An Aston Martin Vantage is a much duller drive; an Audi R8 closer, but no match.




BUT - QUESTIONS

Daily Telegraph
"The seven-speed manual is basically the PDK ’box with slightly different third and seventh ratios. It isn’t a success, presenting a bewildering array of five vertical selection planes"

"Only occasionally do you find a slight hollowness in the steering feel, but it’s a very clever piece of engineering."

Automobile Magazine:
"In fact, the 2012 Porsche 911 has no temper at all. The rear end never feels like it's going to come unstuck. And the steering? Well, it never feels like much at all. As a result, the new 911 doesn't really feel like a 911"

CAR:
"you'll learn to live with it, but there are many other things you can learn to live with but don't necessarily want to have in your life. If you've ever been behind the wheel of a GT3 then its instantly obvious that that delectable steering feel is missing"

MSN UK
"The longer wheelbase provides most of the improvement and electro-mechanical power steering the rest.

It changes the character. The steering is as sharp and precise as ever, but the feedback from bumps and small surface imperfections has largely disappeared. It's all progress says Porsche, but there are also reasons to mourn the loss of the old 911 character."

Classic Car (John SImister)

"And the steering? Porsche claims it to be the most advanced and most natural-feeling electric system yet invented, with new levels of cleverness in the way it interprets the driver's torque inputs to create the correct effect from the cause. But it feels a bit sloppy around the centre, as if there's a loose rubber joint in the system, and there's little in the way of subtle picture-painting feedback, just a level of resistance the electronics judge suitable"

Motor Sport

"And that steering, while not so garrulously communicative as 911 die-hards might like, makes every other electric steering system I’ve tried look nothing less than incompetent."



Autocar

"Not to like? There’s the slightly mushy centre feel of that electric power steering. Being very picky indeed, you could also say that the shift quality of the manual gearbox leaves a smidge to be desired, and may wonder why Porsche still hasn’t made its direct injection engines respond to millimetric throttle adjustments with the same creamy smoothness of its older lumps. But we don’t think you’d wonder for very long"




Clarkson ( quoted from a post here)

JC: "... great engine...awful steering"

Hammond: "it's not awful, it just doesn't feel very 911 anymore"

JC: "... they've ruined it."

TurboS

If they employ the electronic steering in the 991 GT3 RS. I'd keep yours it will appreciate in value.

Ronan

Well. they make at least two very different versions of electric steering, the one in the RSR and the 991 version. Totally different technologies. Maybe they will do something different for the 991 RS. In any case, I will keep an open mind, and intend to hang on to the current cars and let them become old, and see what else Porsche comes up with for the next RS

PoloTurbo

Sounds like a car that is superb but is more easy to drive fast. A good car for anybody to go fast like a gtr. Not everybody can have skill to drive a 911 fast but now... It's a bit simpler.

TurboS

I drove the 991 at Camp 4, it's not simpler, the chassis as compared to the 997 is far better, especially the front end grip. Wider platform yields less understeer, I'm pretty sure the front tires are larger as well.

jasonintoronto

The contact patch of all tires are larger because of the move to 20" rims. However I believe the width remains the same at 235. I remember checking at DFC but my memory of the exact widths is foggy.

jumper5836

20" rims do not give you more contact patch.
I can fit 12" wide wheels on 18's on the rear of my 996. The width is what gives you more contact patch.

exc911ence

I've read that the main reason for the electro-steering is a fuel consumption savings of 0.1mpg. In that case, I'd rather pay slightly more at the pump to keep the steering feel of the older cars intact.

Is fuel efficiency really that important to everyone but me?

jumper5836

So this is a bit disturbing.

The problem with newer cars is everything is electronic and controlled by computer programs.
People are not gonna be happy until the car is being driven by a speaking to it or by using some sort of thing that interprets body movements.

jasonintoronto

Are your sure about that? Wouldn't equal width tires but larger overall diameter enlarge the contact patch in the direction of travel? Fwiw someone from Porsche even mentioned this. It was the reason they lowered the tire pressure in the 991. Maybe I'm misquoting them but I remember reading it.

jasonintoronto

From http://www.insideline.com/porsche/91...carrera-s.html

My feeling is we are both right. 245 vs. 235 width tires make the contact patch wider. 20" vs. 19" tires (making overall tire diameters larger) make the contact patch longer. Can someone confirm? I'm by no means an expert, I just play one on tv.

jumper5836

Yes the contact patch should get longer, probably better grip for deceleration but I would think a wider contact patch is better for lateral grip.
Downside of a larger diameter wheel is more rolling resistance, harder to get heat in them and more unsprung weight.

TurboS

Exactly why I could did not enjoy the 997 GTS 4 on the skidpad
It kept altering the ratio of power to the front based upon throttle and
steering input, never consistent. Quattro Rulz!

jasonintoronto

Interesting. Have you driven a 997.1 awd car? The awd system is decidedly less electronic (viscous clutch)

TurboS

Yes, but not on a skidpad. But from those that have tried it is very difficult as with my Audi, to hold a drift unless you are on Ice.