flosho

What are the advantages to upgrading to bigger brakes? Less brake fade, shorter stopping distances? What else?

I've been told that bigger brakes actually increase stopping distances?

Thanks

hacker-pschorr

Some people also increase hp and drive slower. I don't get it either.

What is the car used for? Street / track, both.....

Bigger brakes (usually)
1. larger pad = greater stopping power
2. larger rotor = greater stopping power
3. larger vents in the rotor = cooler brakes = greater stopping power
4. usually better pads available = better stopping power
5. larger caliper disperses heat better = cooler brakes......

On the street I'm not sure there is any benefit other than they look cool. I didn't care, upgraded the brakes on my 944S to 951 spec.

Techno Duck

Stopping distance is mostly dependent on how much rubber you have on the front. If your wheels lock up then you have enough braking power. Bigger brakes will be more resilient to fade.

Depending which route you take, for example the 951 Brembo's.. the disadvantage is the increased weight from the rotors. The stock single piston calipers are pretty heavy and about the same weight as the 4-piston Brembo's. The difference is the rotors really. Thats increased unsprung weight, increased rotational mass and you must run 16 inch wheels.

The other option is the Rennbay setup which is nice because you can basically retain 15's and stock rotors.

Ive got the complete 951 setup in my car. Works well.. have never been able to utilize the full braking potential of the car (2800lbs). They lock up the stock 205 width tires easily aswell as the 225 summer tires i was running (though not nearly as bad). I recently started using V710 r-compounds and the braking power is pretty ridiculous. I can go that much deeper and brake extremely late into turns. Havent been able to lock them up yet actually (Havent tried).

V2Rocket

Expensive, yes. Shorter stops every time, most likely. Co$t approved by wife, no.

Dan Shea

what do you use the car for? street? track?


They reduce the fade. They also stop quicker.

I would guess that there is diminishing returns on size, like if you go too big the sheer weight would not be beneficial.

flosho

Well I use my car for spirited street driving, and auto-x... Don't have any plans within the next few years to do any real open track racing, but I wilil be autox'ing often.

This topic also stems from a debate that bigger brakes are always worse than stock brakes.

V2Rocket

The stock brakes lock up just fine...those flat spots don't do much for a comfy ride.

Dan Shea

where was i on that debate, would love to hear the other side's perspective.

flosho

on a local forum..

Dan Shea

care to enlighten me why they thought they were bad?

GodSpeed

I have never heard of better brakes making your car worse.

FRporscheman

The VW guys get wilwood brakes pretty often, and they also experience wilwood failures pretty often. Although the advantage of keeping NA rotors and 15" wheels is enticing, if I were looking to upgrade a 944 NA brakes for heavy/extended use, I'd look for a 951 setup first.

flosho

Well I already have 16" wheels so upgrading wouldn't be a problem.

Its just that it seems like a lot of work to go through and source all the 951 parts, or spend a good chunk of change on the rennbay kit.

When I could probably just get good pads, and fluid and wouldn't be outside the limits of the stock brakes.

Weston

"Better" brakes can certainly make stopping distances worse. You need to consider tires and brake balance, otherwise you're probably being counter-productive.

It all has to do with which wheel locks up first, and how easily... When you lock a wheel up under braking, you are actually hurting your stopping performance (and murdering your tires). Maximum braking is achieved at the point just before the wheels lock up, which is called threshold braking. This gives you approximately 30% more traction than a skidding tire. This point has nothing to do with your brakes, and everything to do with your tire grip. Brakes don't stop the car; tires do. If your current brakes will easily lock up the wheels, then upgrading the brakes wont help you stop any better, and will make threshold braking more difficult.

Your stopping performance is limited by the first wheel that locks up, so in a perfect world, you'd want all four brakes balanced so that their wheels are all going to lock up at the same time (of course, there are issues with that in the real world, but that's another discussion). Most cars already have a pretty good front brake bias, mostly for safety reasons. If you add more brake grip to the front without adding any to the rear, you will definitely hurt your performance because the front wheels will just lock up sooner and the rear brakes will be doing less work at that point. In other words, you'll be getting just as much out of the front tires as before, but less out of the rear tires. If you're going to change your brake balance, you'd probably want more grip in the rear, if anything, but that can get a bit dangerous if you're not careful.

marksportcts

If you have the regular 951 Brembo brakes, you do not need 16", and for that matter, not all 16" Porsche wheels even fit. I found out after I upgraded to the 951 brakes and bought a set 911 Fuch wheels where spokes hit the calipers when I tried to mount them. The stock 944 15" phone dial wheels are actually 951 part numbers and properly fit. When you do upgrade to the 951 brakes, remember that you need a proportioning valve. I was running 225/40/18 on the front and 265/35/18 on the rears. The rears would always lock up before the front ever did. Bigger brakes have less fade for continuous use.