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1. The best Tesla charger (wall or plug) will not charge at any higher rate than 48A. - Regardless of what power you connect it to. Yes, you can connect it to a 100A circuit but you can do that with ANY charger. It simply will not use anything beyond 48A (for which you need a 60A circuit). You can't charge at any higher than 48A. The Tesla documentation clearly shows this:
2. Any chargers can be strung together provided the combined capacity doesn't exceed the rated amperage of the circuit/breaker. Combining multiple devices (charger) on a single breaker is pretty typical. You don't have to limit your 120V outlet to just connecting one phone charger do you? Not sure what the big deal about daisy-chaining is. Its just an electrical circuit and it will have to handle the combined load of whatever is connected. The Tesla charger is not doing anything unique here. Additionally, I have a welder and a plasma cutter which share one of the 50A circuits which also holds one of my Level-2 chargers. I just can't use all of them simultaneously.
3. ...and sure, the 4-Prong Nema 14-50 outlets may be the most common, but WHY would you want to eliminate the possibility of ALL the 3-prong Nema 6-50 outlets found in many homes (driers, welders, etc)? That just seems silly?
4. The Tesla mobile charger only charges at 32A. The 3-Prong model I linked is cheaper and will charge at 40A. Your Tesla (and most other EV's) already include a portable (120V) cable so why limit your charging power (and options) by paying more for a lower power charger?
5. Tesla's already come with a J1772 adapter.
#1 IIncorrect - I routinely charge my Tesla Model X at 72 amps! the 48 amp limit is the limit of the Tesla Model 3 on board charging hardware - other Teslas can charge at higher rates - Model S for example with dual chargers can charge at up to 80 amps - the maximum rate of the onboard charging hardware dictates the maximum charge rate - and both the S and X shipped with and can be configured with 72 amps chargers.
#2 the Tesla chargers will configured in master slave mode co-operate to avoid overloading the shared breaker - if multiple cars are charging all at once they lower the reported amerage reported to the car so that it doesn't pull more amps, as cars "finish" charging the remaining amps are directed to to the remaining car up to it's charging limit - when I'm charging my X, 3, and Bolt - each car gets about 24 amps - if the bolt finishes charging both the 3 and X will automatically ramp up to 40 amps to finish their charging sessions - if the 3 finishes and the X is then charging it gets the full 72 amps until it's finished charging. there are few if any chargers on the market that offer this dynamic load sharing. it's designed to exactly address simultaneous usage so that all cars can be scheduled to charge during off-peak hours - it's part of the J-1772 standard.
Its really not that complicated. I'm not trying to convert anything "on the fly"...
- I ALREADY have multiple 4-prong Nema 14-50 outlets in my garage. I can simply plug the Porsche adapter into one of them. Done.
- Although 3-prong (Nema 6-50) chargers can obviously fitted to far more outlets (BOTH 3-Prong AND 4-Prong) that doesn't drive my choice of OUTLET. Quite the opposite.
I would ALWAYS install 4-Prong Nema 14-50 OUTLETS for the very same reason I would always carry a 3-Prong Nema 6-50 CHARGER. The outlets can easily be "stepped down" and the chargers can easily be "stepped up" using a single adapter (and you can't do either the other way around).
see Appendix B pages 30 & 31 for shared load configuration - 1 master and up to 3 slaves - all dynamically sharing load during simultaneous charging sessions and functional in my home for the past 3 years (since spring of 2016 when the gen 2 wall charger shipped).
#1 IIncorrect - I routinely charge my Tesla Model X at 72 amps! the 48 amp limit is the limit of the Tesla Model 3 on board charging hardware - other Teslas can charge at higher rates - Model S for example with dual chargers can charge at up to 80 amps - the maximum rate of the onboard charging hardware dictates the maximum charge rate - and both the S and X shipped with and can be configured with 72 amps chargers.
#2 the Tesla chargers will configured in master slave mode co-operate to avoid overloading the shared breaker - if multiple cars are charging all at once they lower the reported amerage reported to the car so that it doesn't pull more amps, as cars "finish" charging the remaining amps are directed to to the remaining car up to it's charging limit - when I'm charging my X, 3, and Bolt - each car gets about 24 amps - if the bolt finishes charging both the 3 and X will automatically ramp up to 40 amps to finish their charging sessions - if the 3 finishes and the X is then charging it gets the full 72 amps until it's finished charging. there are few if any chargers on the market that offer this dynamic load sharing. it's designed to exactly address simultaneous usage so that all cars can be scheduled to charge during off-peak hours - it's part of the J-1772 standard.
I think you need to read the Tesla documentation Link I provided. None of the vehicles will charge any faster when using a circuit greater than 48A setting. Look at the table in the documentation. The Model 3 charges no faster than 44 mph, Model 3 maxes at 34 mph, and the X at 30 mph. All that happens at 48 A. Increasing your service above that does nothing to improve charging speed.
I think you need to read the Tesla documentation Link I provided. None of the vehicles will charge any faster when using a circuit greater than 48A setting. Look at the table in the documentation. The Model 3 charges no faster than 44 mph, Model 3 maxes at 34 mph, and the X at 30 mph. All that happens at 48 A. Increasing your service above that does nothing to improve charging speed.
so you are saying I have not charged my Model X at 72 amps? when that is in fact what I've been doing since it's purchase in April of 2017? current models might not charge any faster, but mine does.
here is an article discussing the choices between 72 and 48 amp charger - I have the 72 amp charger option - and my previous Model S had the dual charger 80 amp option...
please don't tell me I'm wrong when I factually have a car that can charger in excess of 48 amps.
and what about the 3 prong outlets that are not 50 amp outlets?
Similar adapters are available. What matters is that you can downgrade any 4-prong service (regardless of current rating) for a 3-prong connection but you can't upgrade a 3-prong service to feed a 4-prong connector.
You can't hook up a 4-Prong connector to a 3-Prong service because the 4-Prong connector requires a ground. But you CAN hook up a 3-Prong connector to a 4-Prong service cause you can simple ignore the ground (you don't need it). Many US households already have multiple 3-prong services for driers and welders and other 220V plug in devices. You will find lots of 4-prong to 3-prong generic adapters but NOT the reverse.
so you are saying I have not charged my Model X at 72 amps? when that is in fact what I've been doing since it's purchase in April of 2017? current models might not charge any faster, but mine does.
here is an article discussing the choices between 72 and 48 amp charger - I have the 72 amp charger option - and my previous Model S had the dual charger 80 amp option...
please don't tell me I'm wrong when I factually have a car that can charger in excess of 48 amps.
So, you are claiming the Official Tesla documentation is incorrect? Do you have some other documentation that says differently? If you do, then that's great! Please provide the link. Otherwise I'm going with the online documentation that Tesla provides for their current "100A" wall charger:
Similar adapters are available. What matters is that you can downgrade any 4-prong service (regardless of current rating) for a 3-prong connection but you can't upgrade a 3-prong service to feed a 4-prong connector.
You can't hook up a 4-Prong connector to a 3-Prong service because the 4-Prong connector requires a ground. But you CAN hook up a 3-Prong connector to a 4-Prong service cause you can simple ignore the ground (you don't need it). Many US households already have multiple 3-prong services for driers and welders and other 220V plug in devices. You will find lots of 4-prong to 3-prong generic adapters but NOT the reverse.
A NEMA 6-series has two hots + safety ground. It does NOT have a neutral. When charging at 240V with a 14-series connection, EVs don't use the neutral at all. So making a simple adapter between a 6-50 and a 14-50, for the purposes of EV charging, is trivial.
As Dave noted, older Teslas were available with optional on-board 72- and 80-amp charging configurations. The current models are limited to 48- and 32-amp configurations. Hence your confusion with the current documentation on the Tesla web site vs what used to be available.
I've provided the documentation - Tesla no longer manufactures cars that can charge above 48 amps - but in the past they have and I have owned 3 Teslas that can charger at more than 48 amps
P85. - dual charger option - maximum charge rate 80 amps
P85D - dual charger option - maximum charge rate 80 amps
X P100D - upgraded charger option - maximum charge rate 72 amps
current cars manufactured by Tesla no longer have this as a charging option, but there are about 300,000 Tesla's previously sold prior to 2019 that can charge at a higher rate when optioned appropriately - the Tesla documentation currently posted is overly simplified to reflect the current product mix but is inaccurate regarding previously manufactured products. The Model 3 has _NEVER_ been able to charge at more than 48 amps, there was never an option, I believe in fact the base model is limited to 32 amps, but mid/long range get the 48 amp charger.
here is a 2017 thread discussing the dual charger option for the Model S where several customers upgraded their Model S to charge at 80 amps at home
the Model X had a 72 amp option, although it was standard on the founders models, and the 90 kWh batteries...
Tesla has since 2019 simplified their product line and now 48 amp chargers are standard across the line - although some people say the 72 amp charger is still an option on the S and X if you call and ask for it - YMMV.
I've included a picture of the charging user interface from my Wife's 2017 Model X P100D - the charge rate is 16 kW @ 72 amps @ 229 volts on my 100 AMP 3xTesla charging network.
Last edited by daveo4porsche; 09-17-2019 at 12:50 AM.
.... The Model 3 has _NEVER_ been able to charge at more than 48 amps, there was never an option, I believe in fact the base model is limited to 32 amps, but mid/long range get the 48 amp charger....
Just a nit - but the now-discontinued MR Model 3 came with a 32 amp charger - like the SR does. Only the LR has 48 amp charging.
I've provided the documentation - Tesla no longer manufactures cars that can charge above 48 amps - but in the past they have and I have owned 3 Teslas that can charger at more than 48 amps
P85. - dual charger option - maximum charge rate 80 amps
P85D - dual charger option - maximum charge rate 80 amps
X P100D - upgraded charger option - maximum charge rate 72 amps
current cars manufactured by Tesla no longer have this as a charging option, but there are about 300,000 Tesla's previously sold prior to 2019 that can charge at a higher rate when optioned appropriately - the Tesla documentation currently posted is overly simplified to reflect the current product mix but is inaccurate regarding previously manufactured products. The Model 3 has _NEVER_ been able to charge at more than 48 amps, there was never an option, I believe in fact the base model is limited to 32 amps, but mid/long range get the 48 amp charger.
here is a 2017 thread discussing the dual charger option for the Model S where several customers upgraded their Model S to charge at 80 amps at home
the Model X had a 72 amp option, although it was standard on the founders models, and the 90 kWh batteries...
Tesla has since 2019 simplified their product line and now 48 amp chargers are standard across the line - although some people say the 72 amp charger is still an option on the S and X if you call and ask for it - YMMV.
I've included a picture of the charging user interface from my Wife's 2017 Model X P100D - the charge rate is 16 kW @ 72 amps @ 229 volts on my 100 AMP 3xTesla charging network.
the car will absorb 17.x kW if the supply can keep up 72A at 250V (pretty common to see "220" sag to about 248 and still deliver 17kW ... at 229V, the HPWC is detecting other loads on the circuit ... removing those devices can eke the last few sparks)
I agree the Taycan price is a shock, but if you have to resort to eating crow to make the budget stretch, just wait a few months and they'll be discounting these things like normal. : )
I was planning on "first kid on the block" by ordering early, but now I see the price, I'll happily defer my order till the turbo S is getting some price improvement, after all, even a 5% "good customer" is a useful $10K and goes to defray what will surely be jaw-dropping depreciation on resale in a year or two when they're building them by the bushel.
09-16-2019, 04:11 PM
